From: Eric Stevens <>
Subject: Re: Ripe Apples
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From: Eric Stevens <>
Subject: Re: Ripe Apples
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On Thu, 09 Nov 2017 13:58:17 -0500, nospam<nospam@nospam.invalid>

>In article<>, PeterN
><"peter,newdelete"> wrote:
>> >>> meanwhile, the rest of the world wants to do actual work, not open
>> >>> up their computer and swap parts all day long.
>> >>
>> >> The usual asshat reply from nospam.   People don't "swap parts all day
>> >> long".  They do it when needed from time to time.
>> > 
>> > actually, they don't. the vast majority of users have someone else
>> > repair their computer, just as they do with their cars, tvs and other
>> > products.
>> > 
>> >> When a drive is failing, failed or not large enough it is trivial to
>> >> remove and replace.  About 10 minutes with most desktops.
>> > 
>> > only if someone has the skills and tools.
>> Most people I know have the necessary screwdrivers. If not, they are 
>> available at their local hardware store, for very little money. It is 
>> trivial to open the box and add a drive, or memory.
>trivial for you and me.
>trivial for the average consumer, not so much.
>> I have someone else 
>> do it, because of a physical limitation.
>so it doesn't actually matter. you're making my point.
>> When I tell a repair guy what I 
>> want, and stand there and watch, the time to repair is short, and the 
>> price is very reasonable.
>not all repairs are that quick 

No, some machines are not designed to give the repairer rapid access.

> ... and not all places will let you watch.
>try that at an auto repair shop. 
>> > while readers of usenet might, the general public is not going to open
>> > up a computer to swap a hard drive.
>> >> On a current iMac it can easily take an hour or more.  Tedious.  And no
>> >> reason to make it so difficult other than the Apple aesthetic.
>> > 
>> > the reason is that opening a computer is rarely done, if ever, and
>> > optimizing for that scenario stupid.
>> By that reasoning, all PC box manufacturers and assemblers, including HP 
>> and Dell are run by stupid people.
>pretty much, and a very accurate assessment of dell.

They must be doing something right. They have twice the market share
of Apple. See or

Apart from that Dell does make computers with tool-free access.

>hp has a few interesting products, such as the spectre and yoga, but
>otherwise, it's the same old boring stuff.
>> > it makes a lot more sense to optimize a computer for every day use,
>> > versus something that *might* happen.
>> > 
>> > some cars have the battery in the wheel well, requiring a wheel to be
>> > removed just to swap the battery. since car batteries usually last 5-10
>> > years, that's a very good design decision.
>> > 
>> Ah! more vague advice from the world's best industrial designer.
>more insults and there's nothing vague about it.

It's not relevant though.



Eric Stevens