From: Tony Cooper <tonycooper214@gmail.com>
Subject: Re: CF cards apparently not dead yet
Full headers:
Path: news.netfront.net!goblin3!goblin.stu.neva.ru!news-2.dfn.de!news.dfn.de!fu-berlin.de!uni-berlin.de!individual.net!not-for-mail
From: Tony Cooper <tonycooper214@gmail.com>
Newsgroups: rec.photo.digital
Subject: Re: CF cards apparently not dead yet
Date: Thu, 30 Nov 2017 23:30:49 -0500
Lines: 179
Message-ID: <25i12d9kmctuhca9v12h2sdjiii8bsovi9@4ax.com>
References: <ovnquv0fjr@news3.newsguy.com> <291120172155172901%nospam@nospam.invalid> <ovns9h1g4h@news3.newsguy.com> <291120172209102843%nospam@nospam.invalid> <ovnt8j0glb@news3.newsguy.com> <fp6v1d5cdqqtjp87njgo0gbkddantkdplm@4ax.com> <301120171254418909%nospam@nospam.invalid> <tu712d9i2a7ss45k5c7a5gfhe7dr2l1j56@4ax.com> <301120171946271329%nospam@nospam.invalid> <q1a12d9msklql1uenqv73qfdg3l647mbbs@4ax.com> <301120172122538513%nospam@nospam.invalid>
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
X-Trace: individual.net R+a5EVDHVRE2L+C0ZjXUlQnuxJ4dcVMcgxHWMy/S+03csKVRvE
Cancel-Lock: sha1:OQJjvO2oZXTHVUsJU4rkEDN79ko=
User-Agent: ForteAgent/7.00.32.1200
Print Article
Forward Article
On Thu, 30 Nov 2017 21:22:53 -0500, nospam<nospam@nospam.invalid>
wrote:

>In article<q1a12d9msklql1uenqv73qfdg3l647mbbs@4ax.com>, Tony Cooper
><tonycooper214@gmail.com> wrote:
>
>> >> So we have two people with anecdotal versions.  One says he's not
>> >> concerned with the amount of time it takes to upload photos from a
>> >> card, and the other is concerned that it takes 15 minutes to upload
>> >> his videos.
>> >
>> >since the transfer is local, it's called copying.
>> 
>> The process is called many things...upload, download, import, copy,
>> transfer, etc. 
>
>some of which are incorrect.

No, not at all.  Common usage over time determines correctness of
usage.  For example, a "computer" was once the correct term to
describe the people who calculate as an occupation.  Common usage over
time has made "computer" the correct term to describe the device.  We
no longer call the people who calculate "computers".
 
Since using any of those terms are commonly used to describe the
process, none are incorrect.
>
>> Adobe uses two terms on this page:
>> 
>> https://helpx.adobe.com/bridge/using/import-camera-photos-bridge.htm
>> 
>> The top line says "import photos" and #2 says to "Click Download
>> Images".
>
>download is incorrect, although it's sometimes used for
>camera->computer.

Well, see, that's your problem.  Adobe uses "download" to mean "copy",
and anyone who uses the Adobe program understands this.  So, you can't
really say it is incorrect.  
>
>> SanDisk uses "transfer" and "transfer speed":
>
>transfer is equivalent to copy.

In SanDisk's terminology, yes, but not in the correct meaning of the
word.  Copy creates a new instance but the old instance remains.
Transfer moves the instance from one location to another.

>
>they didn't say upload or download.

No, and that's my point.  Many terms are used, and understood, to
describe the process.  No one of them is correct or incorrect.  

>
>> https://kb.sandisk.com/app/answers/detail/a_id/7491/~/sandisk-produc...
>> r-speed
>> 
>> The different card readers that came up in a search also use
>> "Transfer".
>> 
>> In Lightroom, the word "Copy" is used. but they also use "import" when
>> they say refer to getting images from a card to Lightroom.
>
>importing is much more than a simple copy.

Immaterial.  The process of importing replicates the image on the card
to a location on the computer.  It copies it.  What else happens is
immaterial to this discussion. 
>
>> https://helpx.adobe.com/lightroom/help/importing-photos-lightroom-ba...
>> ow.html
>> 
>> I agree that "upload" or "download" are the least applicable terms,
>
>not only least applicable, but wrong.

No, not "wrong".  As long as there is an established and common
understanding of what is being done, the usage is not wrong.  
>
>> but you can't say that "it's called copying" as if it's the *right*
>> term because "copy" is used less than "transfer" any of the other
>> terms including "upload" and "download" by the general user.
>
>i never said copy was the *only* term, 

That's a typical nospam weasel.  You have said "it's called copying"
and I have replied that it's called many other things.  And you've
argued with that.  Make up your mind.  

>and it's used *far* more often than transfer.

By whom?  Where?  You just make up "facts".  It's not used far more
often in the context of the process of replicating files on  card to
the computer, and that is the subject of this discussion.

>
>a common (yet inefficient) way to copy a file in windows is choose copy
>from the edit menu (or ctrl-c). not transfer.

What has that to do with anything?  The discussion has been about the
replication of files on a card to another location.  Control-c copies
but does not copy anything *to* anywhere.   What it copies is
basically in computer Limbo - which we call the clipboard - until
"Paste" (control-v) is invoked.  

Why introduce a completely different concept into this?

>move is another, although move means deleting the originals.

No, the original is not deleted.  It is relocated.  

Try to think of this in simple terms.  You have an apple in your left
hand.  You move it, or transfer it, to your right hand.  The apple has
been relocated, but it has not been deleted.
>
>import is specific to asset managers, since it's a lot more than just
>copying.
>
>the point is that upload and download are incorrect.
>
>> I like precise use of the correct words in any situation, but there is
>> no precise term in this case.   The *function* is a copy function
>> since the files remain on the original medium and are replicated in a
>> new location, but the term "copy" has not achieved any standard
>> status.
>
>copying does not mean deleting the original.

Right, but I have not said or implied that it does. Quite the
opposite, in fact.
>
>if the original is deleted after a copy, it's a move.

Incorrect since the original is not deleted, it's just relocated.  If
the file has been copied, and the file which was copied is deleted
from where it was copied from, that's a separate and discrete
function.  It's not part of the copy or transfer function. 

>
>> >upload or download would be when it involves a remote system (i.e., the
>> >cloud), which it does not.
>> >
>> For that matter, an upload or a download is also a copy function.  The
>> uploaded or downloaded files are replicated in another location, but
>> we don't use "copy" to describe uploading or downloading.  
>
>sometimes copy is used in that context and may be acceptable. 
>
>examples: copy to the cloud. copy to the server. 

More to my point that there are not standardized and specific terms
and that there are - instead - a number of terms that are
understandable, widely and commonly used, and therefore correct.
>
>> "Transfer" - a widely used term - is sorta incorrect since the files
>> are not transferred from one place to another.  
>
>yes they most certainly are transferred.

To "transfer" is to move from one location to another.  SanDisk is
using the word to mean "copy" or replicate somewhere else.  The files
are not transferred; they never move.  They stay on the card with a
copy placed elsewhere.  What is being transferred is a copy, not the
file.

Again, it's one more validation of my original point:  we have several
terms that are understood to have the same meaning, and none of the
several common terms can be said to be incorrect.
>
>once again, you're *well* out of your league.

I love it when you come up that one.  If it's my league, I can't be
out of it.  The actual saying for what you mean is "You're well out of
my league".  You can't even use a bog-standard ad holmium correctly.

-- 
Tony Cooper - Orlando, Florida