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From: David <dimlan17@yahoo.com>
Subject: Netflix experiment finds viewers say they want subtitles but really prefer dubbing
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From: David <dimlan17@yahoo.com>
Newsgroups: rec.arts.tv
Subject: Netflix experiment finds viewers say they want subtitles but really prefer dubbing
Date: Thu, 08 Mar 2018 16:54:19 -0500
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http://variety.com/2018/digital/news/netflix-success-secrets-120272...

Netflix 

	
From: moviePig <pwallace@moviepig.com>
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Subject: Re: Netflix experiment finds viewers say they want subtitles but
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On 3/8/2018 4:54 PM, David wrote:
> http://variety.com/2018/digital/news/netflix-success-secrets-120272...
> 
> Netflix’s Secrets to Success: Six Cell Towers, Dubbing and More
> By Janko Roettgers
> 
> U.S. consumers overwhelmingly told the company that they wanted to
> watch foreign originals with English subtitles. However, the folks at
> Netflix weren’t so sure that was true, so they streamed a dubbed
> version of the French show “Marseille” to a subset of its viewers by
> default. Those who got the dubbed streams were more likely to finish
> the series than those who watched it with subtitles.
> 
> That’s why Netflix is now streaming dubbed versions of shows by
> default, while still letting users switch to the original with
> subtitle at any time. Consumers seem to like it, no matter what kind
> of notions they might have had about dubbing: In the U.S., the
> majority of viewing of the German drama “Dark” as well as the
> Brazilian sci-fi show “3%” happened with dubbed audio, according to
> Netflix’s international dubbing manager Denise Kreeger.

Subtitle-preference should correspond to the quality of the acting.

-- 

- - - - - - - -
   YOUR taste at work...
     http://www.moviepig.com 

	
From: Ed Stasiak <estasiak@att.net>
Subject: Re: Netflix experiment finds viewers say they want subtitles butreally prefer dubbing
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> David
>
> That’s why Netflix is now streaming dubbed versions of shows by default

I knew this shit was going to happen… fucking globalists.

English is the defacto global language and if foreign productions want to
compete with the Hollywood juggernaut, they need to produce their shows
in English.

I ain’t reading subtitles and sure as hell ain’t watching a show with comical
over-dubbing. 

	
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Subject: Re: Netflix experiment finds viewers say they want subtitles but
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On 3/8/2018 5:36 PM, Ed Stasiak wrote:
>> David
>>
>> That’s why Netflix is now streaming dubbed versions of shows by default
> 
> I knew this shit was going to happen… fucking globalists.
> 
> English is the defacto global language and if foreign productions want to
> compete with the Hollywood juggernaut, they need to produce their shows
> in English.
> 
> I ain’t reading subtitles and sure as hell ain’t watching a show with comical
> over-dubbing.

Believe it or not, these shows aren't made with you in mind -- and 
certainly aren't an attempt to seduce you into godless multi-lingualism. 
  They're merely foreign shows that happen to be good, that have been 
graciously rendered accessible beyond their home borders.  You are, of 
course, free to stick with chop suey and freedom fries.

-- 

- - - - - - - -
   YOUR taste at work...
     http://www.moviepig.com 

	
From: Ian J. Ball <IJBall@mac.invalid>
Subject: Re: Netflix experiment finds viewers say they want subtitles but really prefer dubbing
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From: Ian J. Ball <IJBall@mac.invalid>
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Subject: Re: Netflix experiment finds viewers say they want subtitles but really prefer dubbing
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On 2018-03-08 21:54:19 +0000, David said:

> http://variety.com/2018/digital/news/netflix-success-secrets-120272...
> 
> Netflix 

	
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Subject: Re: Netflix experiment finds viewers say they want subtitles but really prefer dubbing
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In article <p7sgqm$vj0$1@dont-email.me>,
 Ian J. Ball<IJBall@mac.invalid> wrote:

> On 2018-03-08 21:54:19 +0000, David said:
> 
> > http://variety.com/2018/digital/news/netflix-success-secrets-120272...
> > 
> > Netflix 

	
From: Obveeus <Obveeus@aol.com>
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From: Obveeus <Obveeus@aol.com>
Newsgroups: rec.arts.tv
Subject: Re: Netflix experiment finds viewers say they want subtitles but
really prefer dubbing
Date: Thu, 8 Mar 2018 19:22:24 -0500
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On 3/8/2018 4:54 PM, David wrote:
> http://variety.com/2018/digital/news/netflix-success-secrets-120272...
> 
> Netflix’s Secrets to Success: Six Cell Towers, Dubbing and More
> By Janko Roettgers
> 
> U.S. consumers overwhelmingly told the company that they wanted to
> watch foreign originals with English subtitles. However, the folks at
> Netflix weren’t so sure that was true, so they streamed a dubbed
> version of the French show “Marseille” to a subset of its viewers by
> default. Those who got the dubbed streams were more likely to finish
> the series than those who watched it with subtitles.

I wasn't part of this test, but I can say that I stopped watching 
MARSEILLE very early on in season #1.  It wasn't good.

> That’s why Netflix is now streaming dubbed versions of shows by
> default, 

They are?  I've never encountered that problem.

> while still letting users switch to the original with
> subtitle at any time. Consumers seem to like it, no matter what kind
> of notions they might have had about dubbing: In the U.S., the
> majority of viewing of the German drama “Dark” as well as the
> Brazilian sci-fi show “3%” happened with dubbed audio, according to
> Netflix’s international dubbing manager Denise Kreeger.

Americans are very embarrassing people to be associated with at times. 
I understand how dubbing can work with a cartoon since the mouths very 
rarely move with the speech anyway, but mismatched voices coming out of 
real people is horrible. 

	
From: TeeJay1952 <terrancejoyce64@gmail.com>
Subject: Re: Netflix experiment finds viewers say they want subtitles butreally prefer dubbing
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From: TeeJay1952 <terrancejoyce64@gmail.com>
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On 3/8/2018 7:22 PM, Obveeus wrote:
> 
> Americans are very embarrassing people to be associated with at times. I 
> understand how dubbing can work with a cartoon since the mouths very 
> rarely move with the speech anyway, but mismatched voices coming out of 
> real people is horrible.
> 

Isn't your ability to read quikly the determining factor?  I am watching 
a Japanese sub Naruto and am in Season 3. You have to be fast to get all 
dialog. I can only watch 4-5 episodes before eyestrain and fatigue sets 
in. This is with "children's cartoon. A drama or 2 hour movie with 
excessive special effects could prove to be too much.

    Tee (I am really pushing Narato) Jay 

	
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From: Obveeus <Obveeus@aol.com>
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On 3/9/2018 5:58 AM, TeeJay1952 wrote:
> On 3/8/2018 7:22 PM, Obveeus wrote:
>>
>> Americans are very embarrassing people to be associated with at times. 
>> I understand how dubbing can work with a cartoon since the mouths very 
>> rarely move with the speech anyway, but mismatched voices coming out 
>> of real people is horrible.
>>
> 
> Isn't your ability to read quikly the determining factor? 

I have run across a few shows that felt like speed reading contests.  I 
suppose dubbing would make them easier to follow, but at the expense of 
making them so bad that i wouldn't want to follow them.

> I am watching 
> a Japanese sub Naruto and am in Season 3. You have to be fast to get all 
> dialog. I can only watch 4-5 episodes before eyestrain and fatigue sets 
> in. This is with "children's cartoon. A drama or 2 hour movie with 
> excessive special effects could prove to be too much.
> 
>     Tee (I am really pushing Narato) Jay

As I said, dubbing works for animated shows because the mouths don't 
really line up with the speech anyway.  Hopefully they at least try to 
pick voice actors who's voice will work for the character. 

	
From: David <dimlan17@yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: Netflix experiment finds viewers say they want subtitles but really prefer dubbing
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From: David <dimlan17@yahoo.com>
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On Thu, 8 Mar 2018 19:22:24 -0500, Obveeus<Obveeus@aol.com> wrote:

>I understand how dubbing can work with a cartoon since the mouths very 
>rarely move with the speech anyway, but mismatched voices coming out of 
>real people is horrible.

I haven't felt like that's an issue. Thinking about it, I guess I
don't pay that close attention to mouths.

My major issue with dubbing is that if done right it's supposed to
sound like natural speaking, not an exact translation. That's fine,
but I prefer to use closed-captioning and the dubbing then doesn't
match Netflix's captioning which is based off original dialogue and
then you're constantly distracted by the discrepancies. 

	
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In article<4p65ad9ci3poja3caovoqvpe6o9k951ah4@4ax.com>,
 David<dimlan17@yahoo.com> wrote:

> On Thu, 8 Mar 2018 19:22:24 -0500, Obveeus<Obveeus@aol.com> wrote:
> 
> >I understand how dubbing can work with a cartoon since the mouths very 
> >rarely move with the speech anyway, but mismatched voices coming out of 
> >real people is horrible.
> 
> I haven't felt like that's an issue. Thinking about it, I guess I
> don't pay that close attention to mouths.
> 
> My major issue with dubbing is that if done right it's supposed to
> sound like natural speaking, not an exact translation. That's fine,
> but I prefer to use closed-captioning and the dubbing then doesn't
> match Netflix's captioning which is based off original dialogue and
> then you're constantly distracted by the discrepancies.

The Peach and I watched a Norwegian film with dubbing and CC on and 
laughed hysterically about how they didn't match at all.

-- 
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From: Obveeus <Obveeus@aol.com>
Subject: Re: Netflix experiment finds viewers say they want subtitles butreally prefer dubbing
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From: Obveeus <Obveeus@aol.com>
Newsgroups: rec.arts.tv
Subject: Re: Netflix experiment finds viewers say they want subtitles but
really prefer dubbing
Date: Fri, 9 Mar 2018 14:29:50 -0500
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On 3/9/2018 9:36 AM, David wrote:
> On Thu, 8 Mar 2018 19:22:24 -0500, Obveeus<Obveeus@aol.com> wrote:
> 
>> I understand how dubbing can work with a cartoon since the mouths very
>> rarely move with the speech anyway, but mismatched voices coming out of
>> real people is horrible.
> 
> I haven't felt like that's an issue. Thinking about it, I guess I
> don't pay that close attention to mouths.

Not even when the mouth stops moving several seconds before the vocals stop?

> My major issue with dubbing is that if done right it's supposed to
> sound like natural speaking, not an exact translation. That's fine,
> but I prefer to use closed-captioning and the dubbing then doesn't
> match Netflix's captioning which is based off original dialogue and
> then you're constantly distracted by the discrepancies.

That sounds horribly annoying as well. 

	
From: David <dimlan17@yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: Netflix experiment finds viewers say they want subtitles but really prefer dubbing
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From: David <dimlan17@yahoo.com>
Newsgroups: rec.arts.tv
Subject: Re: Netflix experiment finds viewers say they want subtitles but really prefer dubbing
Date: Fri, 09 Mar 2018 15:20:22 -0500
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On Fri, 9 Mar 2018 14:29:50 -0500, Obveeus<Obveeus@aol.com> wrote:

>On 3/9/2018 9:36 AM, David wrote:
>> On Thu, 8 Mar 2018 19:22:24 -0500, Obveeus<Obveeus@aol.com> wrote:
>> 
>>> I understand how dubbing can work with a cartoon since the mouths very
>>> rarely move with the speech anyway, but mismatched voices coming out of
>>> real people is horrible.
>> 
>> I haven't felt like that's an issue. Thinking about it, I guess I
>> don't pay that close attention to mouths.
>
>Not even when the mouth stops moving several seconds before the vocals stop?

They usually make some effort to match length of speech and mouth
movements. There's a whole unappreciated art to it. 

	
From: Obveeus <Obveeus@aol.com>
Subject: Re: Netflix experiment finds viewers say they want subtitles butreally prefer dubbing
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From: Obveeus <Obveeus@aol.com>
Newsgroups: rec.arts.tv
Subject: Re: Netflix experiment finds viewers say they want subtitles but
really prefer dubbing
Date: Fri, 9 Mar 2018 15:23:41 -0500
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On 3/9/2018 3:20 PM, David wrote:
> On Fri, 9 Mar 2018 14:29:50 -0500, Obveeus<Obveeus@aol.com> wrote:
> 
>> On 3/9/2018 9:36 AM, David wrote:
>>> On Thu, 8 Mar 2018 19:22:24 -0500, Obveeus<Obveeus@aol.com> wrote:
>>>
>>>> I understand how dubbing can work with a cartoon since the mouths very
>>>> rarely move with the speech anyway, but mismatched voices coming out of
>>>> real people is horrible.
>>>
>>> I haven't felt like that's an issue. Thinking about it, I guess I
>>> don't pay that close attention to mouths.
>>
>> Not even when the mouth stops moving several seconds before the vocals stop?
> 
> They usually make some effort to match length of speech and mouth
> movements. There's a whole unappreciated art to it.

If that is what they usually try for, then they usually fail.  Combine 
that with voices that are just wrong (octave, tone, whatever) for the 
person who is supposed to be talking and the end result is that dubbing 
is the worst option.
> 

	
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Subject: Re: Netflix experiment finds viewers say they want subtitles but really prefer dubbing
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In article <p7uqgb$chh$1@dont-email.me>, Obveeus<Obveeus@aol.com> 
wrote:

> On 3/9/2018 3:20 PM, David wrote:
> > On Fri, 9 Mar 2018 14:29:50 -0500, Obveeus<Obveeus@aol.com> wrote:
> > 
> >> On 3/9/2018 9:36 AM, David wrote:
> >>> On Thu, 8 Mar 2018 19:22:24 -0500, Obveeus<Obveeus@aol.com> wrote:
> >>>
> >>>> I understand how dubbing can work with a cartoon since the mouths very
> >>>> rarely move with the speech anyway, but mismatched voices coming out of
> >>>> real people is horrible.
> >>>
> >>> I haven't felt like that's an issue. Thinking about it, I guess I
> >>> don't pay that close attention to mouths.
> >>
> >> Not even when the mouth stops moving several seconds before the vocals 
> >> stop?
> > 
> > They usually make some effort to match length of speech and mouth
> > movements. There's a whole unappreciated art to it.
> 
> If that is what they usually try for, then they usually fail.  Combine 
> that with voices that are just wrong (octave, tone, whatever) for the 
> person who is supposed to be talking and the end result is that dubbing 
> is the worst option.
> > 

There *used* to be a great art to it.  I don't think that's so much the 
case any more.

-- 
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