> Prev
From: android <here@there.was>
Subject: Olympus Leads the Japanese MILC Run
Full headers:
Path: news.netfront.net!goblin2!goblin1!goblin.stu.neva.ru!fu-berlin.de!uni-berlin.de!individual.net!not-for-mail
From: android <here@there.was>
Newsgroups: rec.photo.digital
Subject: Olympus Leads the Japanese MILC Run
Date: Wed, 17 Jan 2018 07:33:40 +0100
Organization: the center
Lines: 9
Message-ID: <fc8924F2pk4U1@mid.individual.net>
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; format=flowed
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit
X-Trace: individual.net TwioE4QpK7TLA3pJLFYBXgmzY6RCAlfFsNsKzY2ac8V6BIArTv
Cancel-Lock: sha1:9PRTMGsfDQ1q1LruhoxUWfWxqHE=
User-Agent: Unison/2.2
Print Article
Forward Article
It's still a prosumer game...

<http://www.canonrumors.com/bcn-rankings-are-out-canon-continues-to-... 


<http://tinyurl.com/y9ukoluy>
-- 
teleportation kills 

	
From: Savageduck <savageduck1@{REMOVESPAM}me.com>
Subject: Re: Olympus Leads the Japanese MILC Run
Full headers:
Path: news.netfront.net!goblin3!goblin.stu.neva.ru!news.misty.com!border2.nntp.dca1.giganews.com!nntp.giganews.com!buffer2.nntp.dca1.giganews.com!news.giganews.com.POSTED!not-for-mail
NNTP-Posting-Date: Wed, 17 Jan 2018 00:55:24 -0600
Date: Tue, 16 Jan 2018 22:55:24 -0800
From: Savageduck <savageduck1@{REMOVESPAM}me.com>
Mime-Version: 1.0
User-Agent: Hogwasher/5.17
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit
Message-ID: <0001HW.200F2ADC003CE56C700002AC62CF@news.giganews.com>
Subject: Re: Olympus Leads the Japanese MILC Run
Newsgroups: rec.photo.digital
References: <fc8924F2pk4U1@mid.individual.net>
Lines: 18
X-Usenet-Provider: http://www.giganews.com
X-Trace: sv3-p0QYUFlcrzG3pupkeGv0u4/xKqjyv+Gwh8UBwBLw9kS2Bm+DgFazZ5vmDAzogMkcOIairYX7qo64XCB!DZaQPgymH+uNAKkcXoN4PezTeLYggCpkZmOC+K5GOnxCa8zMf/Q4e0OTzAmxtM3mQ2nvcZuaQ8BP!o7o7cJT4Xa0=
X-Complaints-To: abuse@giganews.com
X-DMCA-Notifications: http://www.giganews.com/info/dmca.html
X-Abuse-and-DMCA-Info: Please be sure to forward a copy of ALL headers
X-Abuse-and-DMCA-Info: Otherwise we will be unable to process your complaint properly
X-Postfilter: 1.3.40
X-Original-Bytes: 1446
Print Article
Forward Article
On Jan 16, 2018, android wrote
(in article<fc8924F2pk4U1@mid.individual.net>:

> It's still a prosumer game...
>
> <http://www.canonrumors.com/bcn-rankings-are-out-canon-continues-to-...
> slrs-further-growth-in-mirrorless/>
>
> <http://tinyurl.com/y9ukoluy>

BCN - Barcelona Airport does camera rankings for Canon Rumors?

That figures.
-- 

Regards,
Savageduck 

	
From: android <here@there.was>
Subject: Re: Olympus Leads the Japanese MILC Run
Full headers:
Path: news.netfront.net!goblin1!goblin.stu.neva.ru!fu-berlin.de!uni-berlin.de!individual.net!not-for-mail
From: android <here@there.was>
Newsgroups: rec.photo.digital
Subject: Re: Olympus Leads the Japanese MILC Run
Date: Wed, 17 Jan 2018 11:00:41 +0100
Organization: the center
Lines: 27
Message-ID: <fc8l69F5fbtU2@mid.individual.net>
References: <fc8924F2pk4U1@mid.individual.net> <0001HW.200F2ADC003CE56C700002AC62CF@news.giganews.com>
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; format=flowed
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit
X-Trace: individual.net Un2Jr6IWq/5q8TGoL4ZVpAMoQd5ia7pXWAmHVcKLB21wRP8uE+
Cancel-Lock: sha1:f2ZQge0rzA06fVfVcN3zhpPcvAQ=
User-Agent: Unison/2.2
Print Article
Forward Article
On 2018-01-17 06:55:24 +0000, Savageduck said:

> On Jan 16, 2018, android wrote
> (in article<fc8924F2pk4U1@mid.individual.net>:
> 
>> It's still a prosumer game...
>> 
>> <http://www.canonrumors.com/bcn-rankings-are-out-canon-continues-to-...
>> slrs-further-growth-in-mirrorless/>
>> 
>> <http://tinyurl.com/y9ukoluy>
> 
> BCN - Barcelona Airport does camera rankings for Canon Rumors?
> 
> That figures.

From the about on the Business Computer News, BCN homepage:

Activities
Research and report on IT market
Managing IT industrial news website "BCN Bizline"
Company marketing and related material development

So it's an IT oriented newservice... OKI?
-- 
teleportation kills 

	
From: Savageduck <savageduck1@{REMOVESPAM}me.com>
Subject: Re: Olympus Leads the Japanese MILC Run
Full headers:
Path: news.netfront.net!goblin2!goblin.stu.neva.ru!peer02.am4!peer.am4.highwinds-media.com!peer03.iad!feed-me.highwinds-media.com!news.highwinds-media.com!border1.nntp.dca1.giganews.com!nntp.giganews.com!buffer1.nntp.dca1.giganews.com!buffer2.nntp.dca1.giganews.com!news.giganews.com.POSTED!not-for-mail
NNTP-Posting-Date: Wed, 17 Jan 2018 06:08:55 -0600
Date: Wed, 17 Jan 2018 04:08:55 -0800
From: Savageduck <savageduck1@{REMOVESPAM}me.com>
Mime-Version: 1.0
User-Agent: Hogwasher/5.17
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit
Message-ID: <0001HW.200F7457004E1E0270000456A2CF@news.giganews.com>
Subject: Re: Olympus Leads the Japanese MILC Run
Newsgroups: rec.photo.digital
References: <fc8924F2pk4U1@mid.individual.net> <0001HW.200F2ADC003CE56C700002AC62CF@news.giganews.com> <fc8l69F5fbtU2@mid.individual.net>
Lines: 36
X-Usenet-Provider: http://www.giganews.com
X-Trace: sv3-Ja58h1pbHjUZ4u5Z2tqPNnm1TyY0O/r1owovjqdsuUZHp7AH0E19AQGSVG1uiIjUtIIHKDcx05v8u4s!VEB8nJiz1YavQVNqdonwCG+wm1OrRGUcET2+2AO/KFr7Jp4pQMseA4wLkim0zItHHTQLEw8R6prH!sqyxJHfQTn4=
X-Complaints-To: abuse@giganews.com
X-DMCA-Notifications: http://www.giganews.com/info/dmca.html
X-Abuse-and-DMCA-Info: Please be sure to forward a copy of ALL headers
X-Abuse-and-DMCA-Info: Otherwise we will be unable to process your complaint properly
X-Postfilter: 1.3.40
X-Original-Bytes: 2080
X-Received-Body-CRC: 3179140952
X-Received-Bytes: 2323
Print Article
Forward Article
On Jan 17, 2018, android wrote
(in article<fc8l69F5fbtU2@mid.individual.net>):

> On 2018-01-17 06:55:24 +0000, Savageduck said:
>
> > On Jan 16, 2018, android wrote
> > (in article<fc8924F2pk4U1@mid.individual.net>:
> >
> > > It's still a prosumer game...
> > >
> > > <http://www.canonrumors.com/bcn-rankings-are-out-canon-continues-to-...
> > > e-d
> > > slrs-further-growth-in-mirrorless/>
> > >
> > > <http://tinyurl.com/y9ukoluy>
> >
> > BCN - Barcelona Airport does camera rankings for Canon Rumors?
> >
> > That figures.
>
> From the about on the Business Computer News, BCN homepage:
>
> Activities
> Research and report on IT market
> Managing IT industrial news website "BCN Bizline"
> Company marketing and related material development
>
> So it's an IT oriented newservice... OKI?

Aah, IT oriented news service, folks who don’t do much photography.

-- 

Regards,
Savageduck 

	
From: android <here@there.was>
Subject: Re: Olympus Leads the Japanese MILC Run
Full headers:
Path: news.netfront.net!goblin1!goblin.stu.neva.ru!fu-berlin.de!uni-berlin.de!individual.net!not-for-mail
From: android <here@there.was>
Newsgroups: rec.photo.digital
Subject: Re: Olympus Leads the Japanese MILC Run
Date: Wed, 17 Jan 2018 17:36:49 +0100
Organization: the center
Lines: 40
Message-ID: <fc9cd1FasahU1@mid.individual.net>
References: <fc8924F2pk4U1@mid.individual.net> <0001HW.200F2ADC003CE56C700002AC62CF@news.giganews.com> <fc8l69F5fbtU2@mid.individual.net> <0001HW.200F7457004E1E0270000456A2CF@news.giganews.com>
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8; format=flowed
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit
X-Trace: individual.net rKF1ckdIf9QRIIKXrNC0OgfqnTs+ZyKGIuVXSUmASlgRDOWLAe
Cancel-Lock: sha1:jJQOb/S76DxNREVkzhUTJ8PPypk=
User-Agent: Unison/2.2
Print Article
Forward Article
On 2018-01-17 12:08:55 +0000, Savageduck said:

> On Jan 17, 2018, android wrote
> (in article<fc8l69F5fbtU2@mid.individual.net>):
> 
>> On 2018-01-17 06:55:24 +0000, Savageduck said:
>> 
>>> On Jan 16, 2018, android wrote
>>> (in article<fc8924F2pk4U1@mid.individual.net>:
>>> 
>>>> It's still a prosumer game...
>>>> 
>>>> <http://www.canonrumors.com/bcn-rankings-are-out-canon-continues-to-...
>>>> e-d
>>>> slrs-further-growth-in-mirrorless/>
>>>> 
>>>> <http://tinyurl.com/y9ukoluy>
>>> 
>>> BCN - Barcelona Airport does camera rankings for Canon Rumors?
>>> 
>>> That figures.
>> 
>> From the about on the Business Computer News, BCN homepage:
>> 
>> Activities
>> Research and report on IT market
>> Managing IT industrial news website "BCN Bizline"
>> Company marketing and related material development
>> 
>> So it's an IT oriented newservice... OKI?
> 
> Aah, IT oriented news service, folks who don’t do much photography.

An old calculator can sum up sales figures. FujiFilm ain't even on the 
map back in their homeland apperantly...

<http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/f/f4/Solar-calculator...
-- 
teleportation kills 

	
From: Savageduck <savageduck1@{REMOVESPAM}me.com>
Subject: Re: Olympus Leads the Japanese MILC Run
Full headers:
Path: news.netfront.net!goblin3!goblin.stu.neva.ru!news.misty.com!border2.nntp.dca1.giganews.com!nntp.giganews.com!buffer2.nntp.dca1.giganews.com!news.giganews.com.POSTED!not-for-mail
NNTP-Posting-Date: Wed, 17 Jan 2018 10:56:31 -0600
Date: Wed, 17 Jan 2018 08:56:31 -0800
From: Savageduck <savageduck1@{REMOVESPAM}me.com>
Mime-Version: 1.0
User-Agent: Hogwasher/5.17
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit
Message-ID: <0001HW.200FB7BF005DEA5E70000456A2CF@news.giganews.com>
Subject: Re: Olympus Leads the Japanese MILC Run
Newsgroups: rec.photo.digital
References: <fc8924F2pk4U1@mid.individual.net> <0001HW.200F2ADC003CE56C700002AC62CF@news.giganews.com> <fc8l69F5fbtU2@mid.individual.net> <0001HW.200F7457004E1E0270000456A2CF@news.giganews.com> <fc9cd1FasahU1@mid.individual.net>
Lines: 54
X-Usenet-Provider: http://www.giganews.com
X-Trace: sv3-cGKxKi1wSIE4C7sAlFCF2Lmsg/wMJpaFrj2Tvc30EBPDzSQsgW/UvwVqv0nilQk32mLJ9YCGCz7yjWF!JMagV8xK1R3io9o5RDSyWW7yPCa6ZcTyAKzVsMcDbRS9I99ZEA1pEApg7CMfTml2MR9M7khLcYtg!TFrX7qIAJ7s=
X-Complaints-To: abuse@giganews.com
X-DMCA-Notifications: http://www.giganews.com/info/dmca.html
X-Abuse-and-DMCA-Info: Please be sure to forward a copy of ALL headers
X-Abuse-and-DMCA-Info: Otherwise we will be unable to process your complaint properly
X-Postfilter: 1.3.40
X-Original-Bytes: 2959
Print Article
Forward Article
On Jan 17, 2018, android wrote
(in article<fc9cd1FasahU1@mid.individual.net>):

> On 2018-01-17 12:08:55 +0000, Savageduck said:
>
> > On Jan 17, 2018, android wrote
> > (in article<fc8l69F5fbtU2@mid.individual.net>):
> >
> > > On 2018-01-17 06:55:24 +0000, Savageduck said:
> > >
> > > > On Jan 16, 2018, android wrote
> > > > (in article<fc8924F2pk4U1@mid.individual.net>:
> > > >
> > > > > It's still a prosumer game...
> > > > >
> > > > > <http://www.canonrumors.com/bcn-rankings-are-out-canon-continues-to-...
> > > > > at
> > > > > e-d
> > > > > slrs-further-growth-in-mirrorless/>
> > > > >
> > > > > <http://tinyurl.com/y9ukoluy>
> > > >
> > > > BCN - Barcelona Airport does camera rankings for Canon Rumors?
> > > >
> > > > That figures.
> > >
> > > From the about on the Business Computer News, BCN homepage:
> > >
> > > Activities
> > > Research and report on IT market
> > > Managing IT industrial news website "BCN Bizline"
> > > Company marketing and related material development
> > >
> > > So it's an IT oriented newservice... OKI?
> >
> > Aah, IT oriented news service, folks who don’t do much photography.
>
> An old calculator can sum up sales figures. FujiFilm ain't even on the
> map back in their homeland apperantly...
>
> <http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/f/f4/Solar-calculator...

Who cares about sales figures?

The bottom line is, having a camera which delivers great IQ, and performance 
while being enjoyable to use. For me Fujifilm delivers that without the over 
the top pricing of Canon, Nikon, and Sony. This is from somebody who has 
spent considerable cash on Nikon DSLRs and glass.

-- 

Regards,
Savageduck 

	
Subject: Re: Olympus Leads the Japanese MILC Run
Full headers:
Path: news.netfront.net!goblin3!goblin2!goblin.stu.neva.ru!news.unit0.net!peer02.am4!peer.am4.highwinds-media.com!peer01.iad!feed-me.highwinds-media.com!news.highwinds-media.com!spln!extra.newsguy.com!newsp.newsguy.com!news3
From: PeterN <"peter,newdelete"@deleteverizon.net>
Newsgroups: rec.photo.digital
Subject: Re: Olympus Leads the Japanese MILC Run
Date: Wed, 17 Jan 2018 12:56:43 -0500
Organization: NewsGuy - Unlimited Usenet $23.95
Lines: 57
Message-ID: <p3o2ot021h4@news3.newsguy.com>
References: <fc8924F2pk4U1@mid.individual.net>
<0001HW.200F2ADC003CE56C700002AC62CF@news.giganews.com>
<fc8l69F5fbtU2@mid.individual.net>
<0001HW.200F7457004E1E0270000456A2CF@news.giganews.com>
<fc9cd1FasahU1@mid.individual.net>
<0001HW.200FB7BF005DEA5E70000456A2CF@news.giganews.com>
NNTP-Posting-Host: p41de56e7873b98929059e96cf70c3047761079c34a22968a.newsdawg.com
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8; format=flowed
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit
User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows NT 6.1; WOW64; rv:52.0) Gecko/20100101
Thunderbird/52.5.2
In-Reply-To: <0001HW.200FB7BF005DEA5E70000456A2CF@news.giganews.com>
Content-Language: en-US
X-Received-Body-CRC: 1808342076
X-Received-Bytes: 3057
Print Article
Forward Article
On 1/17/2018 11:56 AM, Savageduck wrote:
> On Jan 17, 2018, android wrote
> (in article<fc9cd1FasahU1@mid.individual.net>):
> 
>> On 2018-01-17 12:08:55 +0000, Savageduck said:
>>
>>> On Jan 17, 2018, android wrote
>>> (in article<fc8l69F5fbtU2@mid.individual.net>):
>>>
>>>> On 2018-01-17 06:55:24 +0000, Savageduck said:
>>>>
>>>>> On Jan 16, 2018, android wrote
>>>>> (in article<fc8924F2pk4U1@mid.individual.net>:
>>>>>
>>>>>> It's still a prosumer game...
>>>>>>
>>>>>> <http://www.canonrumors.com/bcn-rankings-are-out-canon-continues-to-...
>>>>>> at
>>>>>> e-d
>>>>>> slrs-further-growth-in-mirrorless/>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> <http://tinyurl.com/y9ukoluy>
>>>>>
>>>>> BCN - Barcelona Airport does camera rankings for Canon Rumors?
>>>>>
>>>>> That figures.
>>>>
>>>>  From the about on the Business Computer News, BCN homepage:
>>>>
>>>> Activities
>>>> Research and report on IT market
>>>> Managing IT industrial news website "BCN Bizline"
>>>> Company marketing and related material development
>>>>
>>>> So it's an IT oriented newservice... OKI?
>>>
>>> Aah, IT oriented news service, folks who don’t do much photography.
>>
>> An old calculator can sum up sales figures. FujiFilm ain't even on the
>> map back in their homeland apperantly...
>>
>> <http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/f/f4/Solar-calculator...
> 
> Who cares about sales figures?
> 
> The bottom line is, having a camera which delivers great IQ, and performance
> while being enjoyable to use. For me Fujifilm delivers that without the over
> the top pricing of Canon, Nikon, and Sony. This is from somebody who has
> spent considerable cash on Nikon DSLRs and glass.
> 

True. But when my Nikons are mostly doing want I want, there is no 
reason to switch.  When they eat too much and gain a lot of weight, I 
will consider the alternatives available at that time.

-- 
PeterN 

	
From: Alfred Molon <alfred_molon@yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: Olympus Leads the Japanese MILC Run
Full headers:
Path: news.netfront.net!goblin1!goblin.stu.neva.ru!feeders.as203319.net!feeder02.as203319.net!feeder.erje.net!2.eu.feeder.erje.net!border1.nntp.ams1.giganews.com!nntp.giganews.com!buffer1.nntp.ams1.giganews.com!nntp.supernews.com!news.supernews.com.POSTED!not-for-mail
NNTP-Posting-Date: Wed, 17 Jan 2018 11:58:26 -0600
From: Alfred Molon <alfred_molon@yahoo.com>
Newsgroups: rec.photo.digital
Subject: Re: Olympus Leads the Japanese MILC Run
Date: Wed, 17 Jan 2018 18:58:27 +0100
Message-ID: <MPG.34c9ad2b52671e4a98cf42@news.supernews.com>
References: <fc8924F2pk4U1@mid.individual.net> <0001HW.200F2ADC003CE56C700002AC62CF@news.giganews.com> <fc8l69F5fbtU2@mid.individual.net> <0001HW.200F7457004E1E0270000456A2CF@news.giganews.com> <fc9cd1FasahU1@mid.individual.net> <0001HW.200FB7BF005DEA5E70000456A2CF@news.giganews.com>
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
User-Agent: MicroPlanet-Gravity/3.0.4
Lines: 12
X-Trace: sv3-eOZyjBrtj1IOg9EQUe+q+3DHxxZRT+bvvyWYHmjEqyhsDuhZMzxlu6ju+EqOcAMnJP6vkh5LiG0jBAl!gxbLnel4YE6uiIuZEHj7sFYcvGCEXpIhj3IwBi+afuuaEJUn9dsvOJ7wX0vh8wCr4U4jr1l7FQc4!UxlKhARV1w==
X-Complaints-To: www.supernews.com/docs/abuse.html
X-DMCA-Complaints-To: www.supernews.com/docs/dmca.html
X-Abuse-and-DMCA-Info: Please be sure to forward a copy of ALL headers
X-Abuse-and-DMCA-Info: Otherwise we will be unable to process your complaint properly
X-Postfilter: 1.3.40
X-Original-Bytes: 1635
Print Article
Forward Article
In article<0001HW.200FB7BF005DEA5E70000456A2CF@news.giganews.com>, 
Savageduck says...
> Who cares about sales figures?

If you don't care, ignore this thread which is about sales volumes.

-- 
Alfred Molon

Olympus E-series DSLRs and micro 4/3 forum at
http://tech.groups.yahoo.com/group/MyOlympus/
http://myolympus.org/ photo sharing site 

	
Subject: Re: Olympus Leads the Japanese MILC Run
Full headers:
Path: news.netfront.net!goblin2!goblin.stu.neva.ru!weretis.net!feeder4.news.weretis.net!news.roellig-ltd.de!open-news-network.org!peer02.am4!peer.am4.highwinds-media.com!peer01.iad!feed-me.highwinds-media.com!news.highwinds-media.com!spln!extra.newsguy.com!newsp.newsguy.com!news3
From: PeterN <"peter,newdelete"@deleteverizon.net>
Newsgroups: rec.photo.digital
Subject: Re: Olympus Leads the Japanese MILC Run
Date: Wed, 17 Jan 2018 13:30:41 -0500
Organization: NewsGuy - Unlimited Usenet $23.95
Lines: 14
Message-ID: <p3o4oi02295@news3.newsguy.com>
References: <fc8924F2pk4U1@mid.individual.net>
<0001HW.200F2ADC003CE56C700002AC62CF@news.giganews.com>
<fc8l69F5fbtU2@mid.individual.net>
<0001HW.200F7457004E1E0270000456A2CF@news.giganews.com>
<fc9cd1FasahU1@mid.individual.net>
<0001HW.200FB7BF005DEA5E70000456A2CF@news.giganews.com>
<MPG.34c9ad2b52671e4a98cf42@news.supernews.com>
NNTP-Posting-Host: p218a00c6d1a6c6784e4903da0633fecbabd07145ffe4a4a7.newsdawg.com
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8; format=flowed
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows NT 6.1; WOW64; rv:52.0) Gecko/20100101
Thunderbird/52.5.2
In-Reply-To: <MPG.34c9ad2b52671e4a98cf42@news.supernews.com>
Content-Language: en-US
X-Received-Body-CRC: 3628632919
X-Received-Bytes: 1598
Print Article
Forward Article
On 1/17/2018 12:58 PM, Alfred Molon wrote:
> In article<0001HW.200FB7BF005DEA5E70000456A2CF@news.giganews.com>,
> Savageduck says...
>> Who cares about sales figures?
> 
> If you don't care, ignore this thread which is about sales volumes.
> 

And sales volume has little relationship to the IQ, and photography 
techniques. Sales volume data is better posted in an investment 
discussion group.

-- 
PeterN 

	
From: android <here@there.was>
Subject: Re: Olympus Leads the Japanese MILC Run
Full headers:
Path: news.netfront.net!goblin2!goblin1!goblin.stu.neva.ru!fu-berlin.de!uni-berlin.de!individual.net!not-for-mail
From: android <here@there.was>
Newsgroups: rec.photo.digital
Subject: Re: Olympus Leads the Japanese MILC Run
Date: Wed, 17 Jan 2018 19:50:24 +0100
Organization: the center
Lines: 19
Message-ID: <fc9k7gFcn5vU1@mid.individual.net>
References: <fc8924F2pk4U1@mid.individual.net> <0001HW.200F2ADC003CE56C700002AC62CF@news.giganews.com> <fc8l69F5fbtU2@mid.individual.net> <0001HW.200F7457004E1E0270000456A2CF@news.giganews.com> <fc9cd1FasahU1@mid.individual.net> <0001HW.200FB7BF005DEA5E70000456A2CF@news.giganews.com> <MPG.34c9ad2b52671e4a98cf42@news.supernews.com> <p3o4oi02295@news3.newsguy.com>
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; format=flowed
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit
X-Trace: individual.net kK2pcReGUyiQf1p62bjHIQsr9v0uZHYAFGgkIqYkvUDqvqQlMC
Cancel-Lock: sha1:Yn3VMS0C+4/sDPYPKMeKTjkJSrw=
User-Agent: Unison/2.2
Print Article
Forward Article
On 2018-01-17 18:30:41 +0000, PeterN said:

> On 1/17/2018 12:58 PM, Alfred Molon wrote:
>> In article<0001HW.200FB7BF005DEA5E70000456A2CF@news.giganews.com>,
>> Savageduck says...
>>> Who cares about sales figures?
>> 
>> If you don't care, ignore this thread which is about sales volumes.
>> 
> 
> And sales volume has little relationship to the IQ, and photography 
> techniques. Sales volume data is better posted in an investment 
> discussion group.

Selling cams is a business and good sales is a long term necessity for 
keeping a platform on the market.
-- 
teleportation kills 

	
From: Alfred Molon <alfred_molon@yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: Olympus Leads the Japanese MILC Run
Full headers:
Path: news.netfront.net!goblin2!goblin.stu.neva.ru!ecngs!feeder2.ecngs.de!border1.nntp.ams1.giganews.com!nntp.giganews.com!buffer1.nntp.ams1.giganews.com!buffer2.nntp.ams1.giganews.com!nntp.supernews.com!news.supernews.com.POSTED!not-for-mail
NNTP-Posting-Date: Wed, 17 Jan 2018 15:54:59 -0600
From: Alfred Molon <alfred_molon@yahoo.com>
Newsgroups: rec.photo.digital
Subject: Re: Olympus Leads the Japanese MILC Run
Date: Wed, 17 Jan 2018 22:55:01 +0100
Message-ID: <MPG.34c9e49f874ee78498cf43@news.supernews.com>
References: <fc8924F2pk4U1@mid.individual.net> <0001HW.200F2ADC003CE56C700002AC62CF@news.giganews.com> <fc8l69F5fbtU2@mid.individual.net> <0001HW.200F7457004E1E0270000456A2CF@news.giganews.com> <fc9cd1FasahU1@mid.individual.net> <0001HW.200FB7BF005DEA5E70000456A2CF@news.giganews.com> <MPG.34c9ad2b52671e4a98cf42@news.supernews.com> <p3o4oi02295@news3.newsguy.com>
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
User-Agent: MicroPlanet-Gravity/3.0.4
Lines: 13
X-Trace: sv3-KThoTuEVnGVVGYA2hyGI9hX0C0CzTyi57OKwgTC1X19Z/yxw1AB9wEa5Iv1c1ZBaYaANkjGc4LLTW+t!1bYXbM51bSvfLmfRXPg+g2vH9yD0sFL7HdZuh7E+AlJMyR2oHEdOUf7/icCMZdO2KhM+xFU3+0tI!1cFDKTZYPA==
X-Complaints-To: www.supernews.com/docs/abuse.html
X-DMCA-Complaints-To: www.supernews.com/docs/dmca.html
X-Abuse-and-DMCA-Info: Please be sure to forward a copy of ALL headers
X-Abuse-and-DMCA-Info: Otherwise we will be unable to process your complaint properly
X-Postfilter: 1.3.40
X-Original-Bytes: 1798
Print Article
Forward Article
In article<p3o4oi02295@news3.newsguy.com>, PeterN says...
> 
> And sales volume has little relationship to the IQ, and photography 
> techniques. Sales volume data is better posted in an investment 
> discussion group.

The thread is on topic. It's about digital cameras.
-- 
Alfred Molon

Olympus E-series DSLRs and micro 4/3 forum at
http://tech.groups.yahoo.com/group/MyOlympus/
http://myolympus.org/ photo sharing site 

	
From: Bill W <nothing@nowhere.com>
Subject: Re: Olympus Leads the Japanese MILC Run
Full headers:
Path: news.netfront.net!goblin2!goblin1!goblin.stu.neva.ru!eternal-september.org!feeder.eternal-september.org!reader02.eternal-september.org!.POSTED!not-for-mail
From: Bill W <nothing@nowhere.com>
Newsgroups: rec.photo.digital
Subject: Re: Olympus Leads the Japanese MILC Run
Date: Wed, 17 Jan 2018 11:41:19 -0800
Organization: A noiseless patient Spider
Lines: 60
Message-ID: <dc9v5dhup5p2ol7rgos3em6r7qcfsdtpgj@4ax.com>
References: <fc8924F2pk4U1@mid.individual.net> <0001HW.200F2ADC003CE56C700002AC62CF@news.giganews.com> <fc8l69F5fbtU2@mid.individual.net> <0001HW.200F7457004E1E0270000456A2CF@news.giganews.com> <fc9cd1FasahU1@mid.individual.net> <0001HW.200FB7BF005DEA5E70000456A2CF@news.giganews.com>
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit
Injection-Info: reader02.eternal-september.org; posting-host="a0fc448f63afc0e7ebd40c4b699f450f";
logging-data="29492"; mail-complaints-to="abuse@eternal-september.org";posting-account="U2FsdGVkX19qEdaxxcvUoPWTzy08s12GoYVbFAhrJ78="
User-Agent: ForteAgent/7.20.32.1218
Cancel-Lock: sha1:OKfumuXP6DhXtC3Fawz7VQ9GMGU=
Print Article
Forward Article
On Wed, 17 Jan 2018 08:56:31 -0800, Savageduck
<savageduck1@{REMOVESPAM}me.com> wrote:

>On Jan 17, 2018, android wrote
>(in article<fc9cd1FasahU1@mid.individual.net>):
>
>> On 2018-01-17 12:08:55 +0000, Savageduck said:
>>
>> > On Jan 17, 2018, android wrote
>> > (in article<fc8l69F5fbtU2@mid.individual.net>):
>> >
>> > > On 2018-01-17 06:55:24 +0000, Savageduck said:
>> > >
>> > > > On Jan 16, 2018, android wrote
>> > > > (in article<fc8924F2pk4U1@mid.individual.net>:
>> > > >
>> > > > > It's still a prosumer game...
>> > > > >
>> > > > > <http://www.canonrumors.com/bcn-rankings-are-out-canon-continues-to-...
>> > > > > at
>> > > > > e-d
>> > > > > slrs-further-growth-in-mirrorless/>
>> > > > >
>> > > > > <http://tinyurl.com/y9ukoluy>
>> > > >
>> > > > BCN - Barcelona Airport does camera rankings for Canon Rumors?
>> > > >
>> > > > That figures.
>> > >
>> > > From the about on the Business Computer News, BCN homepage:
>> > >
>> > > Activities
>> > > Research and report on IT market
>> > > Managing IT industrial news website "BCN Bizline"
>> > > Company marketing and related material development
>> > >
>> > > So it's an IT oriented newservice... OKI?
>> >
>> > Aah, IT oriented news service, folks who don 

	
From: android <here@there.was>
Subject: Re: Olympus Leads the Japanese MILC Run
Full headers:
Path: news.netfront.net!goblin3!goblin2!goblin1!goblin.stu.neva.ru!fu-berlin.de!uni-berlin.de!individual.net!not-for-mail
From: android <here@there.was>
Newsgroups: rec.photo.digital
Subject: Re: Olympus Leads the Japanese MILC Run
Date: Wed, 17 Jan 2018 21:18:10 +0100
Organization: the center
Lines: 71
Message-ID: <fc9pc2FdtsvU1@mid.individual.net>
References: <fc8924F2pk4U1@mid.individual.net> <0001HW.200F2ADC003CE56C700002AC62CF@news.giganews.com> <fc8l69F5fbtU2@mid.individual.net> <0001HW.200F7457004E1E0270000456A2CF@news.giganews.com> <fc9cd1FasahU1@mid.individual.net> <0001HW.200FB7BF005DEA5E70000456A2CF@news.giganews.com> <dc9v5dhup5p2ol7rgos3em6r7qcfsdtpgj@4ax.com>
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; format=flowed
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit
X-Trace: individual.net l42EnTUsTff676PAao3qhguiB2rdDWTXVgytYcAcwwdNh0Q8OZ
Cancel-Lock: sha1:Ba1It2QuKJLKrx99FhApwGogB0g=
User-Agent: Unison/2.2
Print Article
Forward Article
On 2018-01-17 19:41:19 +0000, Bill W said:

> On Wed, 17 Jan 2018 08:56:31 -0800, Savageduck
> <savageduck1@{REMOVESPAM}me.com> wrote:
> 
>> On Jan 17, 2018, android wrote
>> (in article<fc9cd1FasahU1@mid.individual.net>):
>> 
>>> On 2018-01-17 12:08:55 +0000, Savageduck said:
>>> 
>>>> On Jan 17, 2018, android wrote
>>>> (in article<fc8l69F5fbtU2@mid.individual.net>):
>>>> 
>>>>> On 2018-01-17 06:55:24 +0000, Savageduck said:
>>>>> 
>>>>>> On Jan 16, 2018, android wrote
>>>>>> (in article<fc8924F2pk4U1@mid.individual.net>:
>>>>>> 
>>>>>>> It's still a prosumer game...
>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>> <http://www.canonrumors.com/bcn-rankings-are-out-canon-continues-to-...
>>>>>>> at
>>>>>>> e-d
>>>>>>> slrs-further-growth-in-mirrorless/>
>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>> <http://tinyurl.com/y9ukoluy>
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> BCN - Barcelona Airport does camera rankings for Canon Rumors?
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> That figures.
>>>>> 
>>>>> From the about on the Business Computer News, BCN homepage:
>>>>> 
>>>>> Activities
>>>>> Research and report on IT market
>>>>> Managing IT industrial news website "BCN Bizline"
>>>>> Company marketing and related material development
>>>>> 
>>>>> So it's an IT oriented newservice... OKI?
>>>> 
>>>> Aah, IT oriented news service, folks who don 

	
From: Savageduck <savageduck1@{REMOVESPAM}me.com>
Subject: Re: Olympus Leads the Japanese MILC Run
Full headers:
Path: news.netfront.net!goblin3!goblin.stu.neva.ru!news.misty.com!border2.nntp.dca1.giganews.com!nntp.giganews.com!buffer2.nntp.dca1.giganews.com!buffer1.nntp.dca1.giganews.com!news.giganews.com.POSTED!not-for-mail
NNTP-Posting-Date: Wed, 17 Jan 2018 16:06:25 -0600
Date: Wed, 17 Jan 2018 14:06:25 -0800
From: Savageduck <savageduck1@{REMOVESPAM}me.com>
Mime-Version: 1.0
User-Agent: Hogwasher/5.17
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit
Message-ID: <0001HW.20100061006EF04E70000456A2CF@news.giganews.com>
Subject: Re: Olympus Leads the Japanese MILC Run
Newsgroups: rec.photo.digital
References: <fc8924F2pk4U1@mid.individual.net> <0001HW.200F2ADC003CE56C700002AC62CF@news.giganews.com> <fc8l69F5fbtU2@mid.individual.net> <0001HW.200F7457004E1E0270000456A2CF@news.giganews.com> <fc9cd1FasahU1@mid.individual.net> <0001HW.200FB7BF005DEA5E70000456A2CF@news.giganews.com> <dc9v5dhup5p2ol7rgos3em6r7qcfsdtpgj@4ax.com> <fc9pc2FdtsvU1@mid.individual.net>
Lines: 101
X-Usenet-Provider: http://www.giganews.com
X-Trace: sv3-rajgPaQwS/uTGsEUPSanovb5StC5ItPj8oFBF0l0HiPSjdL4kay88esDTj8vnTSqAix7A9m6Oo2OGOD!VtXKm/WEE1hH7dcNYkbyxbF3yQM/mPDpQcSaidI+1ZF7+I09uFqoucDt+evNeMDKHJbPGZ3PMdqb!CO+oqZTpucg=
X-Complaints-To: abuse@giganews.com
X-DMCA-Notifications: http://www.giganews.com/info/dmca.html
X-Abuse-and-DMCA-Info: Please be sure to forward a copy of ALL headers
X-Abuse-and-DMCA-Info: Otherwise we will be unable to process your complaint properly
X-Postfilter: 1.3.40
X-Original-Bytes: 5107
Print Article
Forward Article
On Jan 17, 2018, android wrote
(in article<fc9pc2FdtsvU1@mid.individual.net>):

> On 2018-01-17 19:41:19 +0000, Bill W said:
>
> > On Wed, 17 Jan 2018 08:56:31 -0800, Savageduck
> > <savageduck1@{REMOVESPAM}me.com>  wrote:
> >
> > > On Jan 17, 2018, android wrote
> > > (in article<fc9cd1FasahU1@mid.individual.net>):
> > >
> > > > On 2018-01-17 12:08:55 +0000, Savageduck said:
> > > >
> > > > > On Jan 17, 2018, android wrote
> > > > > (in article<fc8l69F5fbtU2@mid.individual.net>):
> > > > >
> > > > > > On 2018-01-17 06:55:24 +0000, Savageduck said:
> > > > > >
> > > > > > > On Jan 16, 2018, android wrote
> > > > > > > (in article<fc8924F2pk4U1@mid.individual.net>:
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > It's still a prosumer game...
> > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > <http://www.canonrumors.com/bcn-rankings-are-out-canon-continues-to-...
> > > > > > > > min
> > > > > > > > at
> > > > > > > > e-d
> > > > > > > > slrs-further-growth-in-mirrorless/>
> > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > <http://tinyurl.com/y9ukoluy>
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > > BCN - Barcelona Airport does camera rankings for Canon Rumors?
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > > That figures.
> > > > > >
> > > > > > From the about on the Business Computer News, BCN homepage:
> > > > > >
> > > > > > Activities
> > > > > > Research and report on IT market
> > > > > > Managing IT industrial news website "BCN Bizline"
> > > > > > Company marketing and related material development
> > > > > >
> > > > > > So it's an IT oriented newservice... OKI?
> > > > >
> > > > > Aah, IT oriented news service, folks who don’t do much photography.
> > > >
> > > > An old calculator can sum up sales figures. FujiFilm ain't even on the
> > > > map back in their homeland apperantly...
> > > >
> > > > <http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/f/f4/Solar-calculator...
> > >
> > > Who cares about sales figures?
> >
> > I do, along with lots of other people - for example, Pentax users.
> > It's already become a problem, with fewer and fewer 3d party lens
> > makers, for instance. And it's not just the 3d parties, if Pentax
> > itself folds, there is no more support for anything, and no future at
> > all.
> >
> > > The bottom line is, having a camera which delivers great IQ, and
> > > performance
> > > while being enjoyable to use. For me Fujifilm delivers that without the
> > > over
> > > the top pricing of Canon, Nikon, and Sony. This is from somebody who has
> > > spent considerable cash on Nikon DSLRs and glass.
> >
> > I think Fuji is a considerably more robust than Pentax, so you
> > shouldn't have to worry.
>
> Maybe they should merge?

Nope!

> Fuji is the holy mountain of Japan and some Japanese could consider it heresy to put that name on
a camera,

They haven’t, and it doesn’t look like they would. The company is 
Fujifilm, not Fuji, and in Japan there are hundreds, if not thousands of 
products and businesses with “Fuji” in their names.

> and some mainland Asians may have some lingering bitterness since the WWII
> and might avoid such a brand for that association.

So far that does not seem to have happened. Fujifilm is doing just fine in 
Malaysia, Indonesia, Singapore, even Australia.

> Pentax OTOH is a brand of heritage and used to be popular with the masses world wide...

Sadly yes. My K1000 will attest to that. However, Fujifilm has a 
photographic, imaging, and optics heritage as long, if not longer than 
Pentax.
<http://www.fujifilm.com/about/history/corporate_history/>

....and now we have the spectre of a full Fuji Xerox merger.

<http://fortune.com/2018/01/11/xerox-deal-talk-fujifilm-japan/>

-- 

Regards,
Savageduck 

	
From: Savageduck <savageduck1@{REMOVESPAM}me.com>
Subject: Re: Olympus Leads the Japanese MILC Run
Full headers:
Path: news.netfront.net!goblin2!goblin.stu.neva.ru!peer02.am4!peer.am4.highwinds-media.com!peer02.iad!feed-me.highwinds-media.com!news.highwinds-media.com!border1.nntp.dca1.giganews.com!nntp.giganews.com!buffer1.nntp.dca1.giganews.com!buffer2.nntp.dca1.giganews.com!news.giganews.com.POSTED!not-for-mail
NNTP-Posting-Date: Wed, 17 Jan 2018 15:46:56 -0600
Date: Wed, 17 Jan 2018 13:46:56 -0800
From: Savageduck <savageduck1@{REMOVESPAM}me.com>
Mime-Version: 1.0
User-Agent: Hogwasher/5.17
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit
Message-ID: <0001HW.200FFBD0006DDE4C70000456A2CF@news.giganews.com>
Subject: Re: Olympus Leads the Japanese MILC Run
Newsgroups: rec.photo.digital
References: <fc8924F2pk4U1@mid.individual.net> <0001HW.200F2ADC003CE56C700002AC62CF@news.giganews.com> <fc8l69F5fbtU2@mid.individual.net> <0001HW.200F7457004E1E0270000456A2CF@news.giganews.com> <fc9cd1FasahU1@mid.individual.net> <0001HW.200FB7BF005DEA5E70000456A2CF@news.giganews.com> <dc9v5dhup5p2ol7rgos3em6r7qcfsdtpgj@4ax.com>
Lines: 99
X-Usenet-Provider: http://www.giganews.com
X-Trace: sv3-3rFp1+f37gXzyjAVKBORbJn5rgM9wp1IuDIvQz/1MQW3CtJgIGMsD06adqP079jjpaOFwd0zIziSs5R!MUESvQUlac1kFa05/XeXk9kJQSB994Uj+5c3vFMXB/dRccJDCvYllZqh+1yES4k2ECjubSErrjE5!3InyUv04W40=
X-Complaints-To: abuse@giganews.com
X-DMCA-Notifications: http://www.giganews.com/info/dmca.html
X-Abuse-and-DMCA-Info: Please be sure to forward a copy of ALL headers
X-Abuse-and-DMCA-Info: Otherwise we will be unable to process your complaint properly
X-Postfilter: 1.3.40
X-Original-Bytes: 5649
X-Received-Body-CRC: 3434163964
X-Received-Bytes: 5892
Print Article
Forward Article
On Jan 17, 2018, Bill W wrote
(in article<dc9v5dhup5p2ol7rgos3em6r7qcfsdtpgj@4ax.com>):

> On Wed, 17 Jan 2018 08:56:31 -0800, Savageduck
> <savageduck1@{REMOVESPAM}me.com>  wrote:
>
> > On Jan 17, 2018, android wrote
> > (in article<fc9cd1FasahU1@mid.individual.net>):
> >
> > > On 2018-01-17 12:08:55 +0000, Savageduck said:
> > >
> > > > On Jan 17, 2018, android wrote
> > > > (in article<fc8l69F5fbtU2@mid.individual.net>):
> > > >
> > > > > On 2018-01-17 06:55:24 +0000, Savageduck said:
> > > > >
> > > > > > On Jan 16, 2018, android wrote
> > > > > > (in article<fc8924F2pk4U1@mid.individual.net>:
> > > > > >
> > > > > > > It's still a prosumer game...
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > > <http://www.canonrumors.com/bcn-rankings-are-out-canon-continues-to-...
> > > > > > > in
> > > > > > > at
> > > > > > > e-d
> > > > > > > slrs-further-growth-in-mirrorless/>
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > > <http://tinyurl.com/y9ukoluy>
> > > > > >
> > > > > > BCN - Barcelona Airport does camera rankings for Canon Rumors?
> > > > > >
> > > > > > That figures.
> > > > >
> > > > > From the about on the Business Computer News, BCN homepage:
> > > > >
> > > > > Activities
> > > > > Research and report on IT market
> > > > > Managing IT industrial news website "BCN Bizline"
> > > > > Company marketing and related material development
> > > > >
> > > > > So it's an IT oriented newservice... OKI?
> > > >
> > > > Aah, IT oriented news service, folks who don’t do much photography.
> > >
> > > An old calculator can sum up sales figures. FujiFilm ain't even on the
> > > map back in their homeland apperantly...
> > >
> > > <http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/f/f4/Solar-calculator...
> >
> > Who cares about sales figures?
>
> I do, along with lots of other people - for example, Pentax users.
> It's already become a problem, with fewer and fewer 3d party lens
> makers, for instance. And it's not just the 3d parties, if Pentax
> itself folds, there is no more support for anything, and no future at
> all.

I agree. The financial health of any consumer oriented business is dependant 
on sales. Photographers, pro, enthusiasts, and snap-shooters are the target 
consumer groups being carved up by the various camera maufacturers. However, 
there are other factors at play with the various production philosophies, and 
the cameras on offer to us, the folks feeding those corporations. In the case 
of Pentax, there is only Pentax to blame for their current precarious 
position.
....and the inroads into the photography consumer pie that cameras in smart 
phones have made cannot be denied.

I have nothing against Pentax, as a teenager my first SLR was a Pentax. The 
only 35mm cameras I own today are a K1000, and a 49 year old Yashica 
Electro35. When I made the move to the digital world I was drawn to what 
Nikon had to offer, because Yashica had died, and Pentax had nothing to offer 
which matched Nikon, or Canon at that time. Currently it is Fujifilm which 
meets my photography needs, both from an economic, and a cost perspective. I 
might well have moved to Olympus, but Fujifilm with the quality glass 
available, and their Kaizen philosophy adding value, and function with 
firmware updates/upgrades has gained my following. Pentax might have regained 
my following if they had offered a product to push me back into their fold. 
As to what the future holds for them, and their slice of the pie without some 
sort of paradigm shift on their part, I could not say. For me, Fujifilm made 
that paradigm shift 6 years ago and ran with it, gaining me three years ago. 
Nikon is vanishing over the horizon of unaffordability.

>
> > The bottom line is, having a camera which delivers great IQ, and performance
> > while being enjoyable to use. For me Fujifilm delivers that without the over
> > the top pricing of Canon, Nikon, and Sony. This is from somebody who has
> > spent considerable cash on Nikon DSLRs and glass.
>
> I think Fuji is a considerably more robust than Pentax, so you
> shouldn't have to worry.

Sadly, I have to agree, though it would be nice to see Pentax do something 
exciting, there is just too much from the photographic past that is gone.

-- 

Regards,
Savageduck 

	
From: Bill W <nothing@nowhere.com>
Subject: Re: Olympus Leads the Japanese MILC Run
Full headers:
Path: news.netfront.net!goblin2!goblin1!goblin.stu.neva.ru!eternal-september.org!feeder.eternal-september.org!reader02.eternal-september.org!.POSTED!not-for-mail
From: Bill W <nothing@nowhere.com>
Newsgroups: rec.photo.digital
Subject: Re: Olympus Leads the Japanese MILC Run
Date: Wed, 17 Jan 2018 18:02:30 -0800
Organization: A noiseless patient Spider
Lines: 114
Message-ID: <9hvv5d5cp6ku3a3dbconolc4ilme31v4vn@4ax.com>
References: <fc8924F2pk4U1@mid.individual.net> <0001HW.200F2ADC003CE56C700002AC62CF@news.giganews.com> <fc8l69F5fbtU2@mid.individual.net> <0001HW.200F7457004E1E0270000456A2CF@news.giganews.com> <fc9cd1FasahU1@mid.individual.net> <0001HW.200FB7BF005DEA5E70000456A2CF@news.giganews.com> <dc9v5dhup5p2ol7rgos3em6r7qcfsdtpgj@4ax.com> <0001HW.200FFBD0006DDE4C70000456A2CF@news.giganews.com>
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit
Injection-Info: reader02.eternal-september.org; posting-host="3c7823900c719aba549279257d6bb850";
logging-data="22219"; mail-complaints-to="abuse@eternal-september.org";posting-account="U2FsdGVkX18XLSSu9hddphEURwn3aL4BGAQoepUjJWs="
User-Agent: ForteAgent/7.20.32.1218
Cancel-Lock: sha1:R/DXKeSmxQPdoFT7nvJIkQyqq1U=
Print Article
Forward Article
On Wed, 17 Jan 2018 13:46:56 -0800, Savageduck
<savageduck1@{REMOVESPAM}me.com> wrote:

>On Jan 17, 2018, Bill W wrote
>(in article<dc9v5dhup5p2ol7rgos3em6r7qcfsdtpgj@4ax.com>):
>
>> On Wed, 17 Jan 2018 08:56:31 -0800, Savageduck
>> <savageduck1@{REMOVESPAM}me.com>  wrote:
>>
>> > On Jan 17, 2018, android wrote
>> > (in article<fc9cd1FasahU1@mid.individual.net>):
>> >
>> > > On 2018-01-17 12:08:55 +0000, Savageduck said:
>> > >
>> > > > On Jan 17, 2018, android wrote
>> > > > (in article<fc8l69F5fbtU2@mid.individual.net>):
>> > > >
>> > > > > On 2018-01-17 06:55:24 +0000, Savageduck said:
>> > > > >
>> > > > > > On Jan 16, 2018, android wrote
>> > > > > > (in article<fc8924F2pk4U1@mid.individual.net>:
>> > > > > >
>> > > > > > > It's still a prosumer game...
>> > > > > > >
>> > > > > > > <http://www.canonrumors.com/bcn-rankings-are-out-canon-continues-to-...
>> > > > > > > in
>> > > > > > > at
>> > > > > > > e-d
>> > > > > > > slrs-further-growth-in-mirrorless/>
>> > > > > > >
>> > > > > > > <http://tinyurl.com/y9ukoluy>
>> > > > > >
>> > > > > > BCN - Barcelona Airport does camera rankings for Canon Rumors?
>> > > > > >
>> > > > > > That figures.
>> > > > >
>> > > > > From the about on the Business Computer News, BCN homepage:
>> > > > >
>> > > > > Activities
>> > > > > Research and report on IT market
>> > > > > Managing IT industrial news website "BCN Bizline"
>> > > > > Company marketing and related material development
>> > > > >
>> > > > > So it's an IT oriented newservice... OKI?
>> > > >
>> > > > Aah, IT oriented news service, folks who don 

	
From: RichA <rander3128@gmail.com>
Subject: Re: Olympus Leads the Japanese MILC Run
Full headers:
X-Received: by 10.55.124.198 with SMTP id x189mr30681901qkc.30.1516196462709;
Wed, 17 Jan 2018 05:41:02 -0800 (PST)
X-Received: by 10.31.50.209 with SMTP id y200mr207809vky.3.1516196462345; Wed,
17 Jan 2018 05:41:02 -0800 (PST)
Path: news.netfront.net!goblin3!goblin2!goblin.stu.neva.ru!peer02.am4!peer.am4.highwinds-media.com!peer03.iad!feed-me.highwinds-media.com!news.highwinds-media.com!i22no3447990qta.1!news-out.google.com!e39ni1243qtk.1!nntp.google.com!i22no3447989qta.1!postnews.google.com!glegroupsg2000goo.googlegroups.com!not-for-mail
Newsgroups: rec.photo.digital
Date: Wed, 17 Jan 2018 05:41:02 -0800 (PST)
In-Reply-To: <fc8924F2pk4U1@mid.individual.net>
Complaints-To: groups-abuse@google.com
Injection-Info: glegroupsg2000goo.googlegroups.com; posting-host=65.95.0.172; posting-account=8Vsz_woAAABQPV3Epo66m_rYvK1EHzOV
NNTP-Posting-Host: 65.95.0.172
References: <fc8924F2pk4U1@mid.individual.net>
User-Agent: G2/1.0
MIME-Version: 1.0
Message-ID: <82a71ff9-f7c6-4edf-b73c-20ee3eb6cd7f@googlegroups.com>
Subject: Re: Olympus Leads the Japanese MILC Run
From: RichA <rander3128@gmail.com>
Injection-Date: Wed, 17 Jan 2018 13:41:02 +0000
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8"
X-Received-Body-CRC: 1598738035
X-Received-Bytes: 1533
Print Article
Forward Article
On Wednesday, 17 January 2018 01:33:44 UTC-5, android  wrote:
> It's still a prosumer game...
> 
>
<http://www.canonrumors.com/bcn-rankings-are-out-canon-continues-to-... 
> 
> 
> <http://tinyurl.com/y9ukoluy>
> -- 
> teleportation kills

I wonder if Sony will finally off their "DSLR" line? 

	
Subject: Re: Olympus Leads the Japanese MILC Run
Full headers:
Path: news.netfront.net!goblin2!goblin1!goblin.stu.neva.ru!eternal-september.org!feeder.eternal-september.org!reader02.eternal-september.org!.POSTED!not-for-mail
From: Neil <neil@myplaceofwork.com>
Newsgroups: rec.photo.digital
Subject: Re: Olympus Leads the Japanese MILC Run
Date: Wed, 17 Jan 2018 20:36:31 -0500
Organization: A noiseless patient Spider
Lines: 34
Message-ID: <p3otmo$dq9$1@dont-email.me>
References: <fc8924F2pk4U1@mid.individual.net>
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8; format=flowed
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
Injection-Date: Thu, 18 Jan 2018 01:36:24 -0000 (UTC)
Injection-Info: reader02.eternal-september.org; posting-host="839422096e0232bce0f03b1f3ab85096";
logging-data="14153"; mail-complaints-to="abuse@eternal-september.org";posting-account="U2FsdGVkX1+DUOwDP9b/p6ReOkr3GAFqiD7ICz99NCc="
User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows NT 10.0; WOW64; rv:52.0) Gecko/20100101
Thunderbird/52.5.2
In-Reply-To: <fc8924F2pk4U1@mid.individual.net>
Content-Language: en-US
Cancel-Lock: sha1:8Zy5JQlrvHm83DqtXppoBkKwC7o=
Print Article
Forward Article
On 1/17/2018 1:33 AM, android wrote:
> It's still a prosumer game...
> 
>
<http://www.canonrumors.com/bcn-rankings-are-out-canon-continues-to-... 
> 
> 
> <http://tinyurl.com/y9ukoluy>
 >
I think it's interesting that this topic goes on and on about camera 
makes *other* than Olympus. I take it that there aren't many (if any) 
Olympus users in this group, so I'll chime in with my 2 cents.

In film cameras, I have 3 makes: Olympus, Leica and Rolleiflex. I was 
always drawn to Olympus' superior technology when it came to compact 
design (OM-1, very durable, compact and reliable) metering (OM-4 is 
unique in this respect), and image quality. Its lenses aren't the best 
that I have, but then I have lenses for my Leica and Rollei that each 
cost more than a few entire Olympus kits. However, unlike my Zeiss, 
Leica and Schneider lenses, the Olympus' delivers consistent contrast 
over the range of stops. I realize this implies some compromises, but it 
makes it easier to use DOF as the primary variable when framing and 
shooting.

In digital cameras, I have Nikon and Olympus. The Olympus is superior in 
every way, from the available options to the structure of its menu, 
making significant changes easy and fast.

So, it doesn't surprise me in the least that those who are dedicated to 
photography find themselves drawn to the Olympus line.

-- 
best regards,

Neil 

	
From: Savageduck <savageduck1@{REMOVESPAM}me.com>
Subject: Re: Olympus Leads the Japanese MILC Run
Full headers:
Path: news.netfront.net!goblin3!goblin.stu.neva.ru!news.misty.com!border2.nntp.dca1.giganews.com!nntp.giganews.com!buffer2.nntp.dca1.giganews.com!news.giganews.com.POSTED!not-for-mail
NNTP-Posting-Date: Wed, 17 Jan 2018 21:53:56 -0600
Date: Wed, 17 Jan 2018 19:53:56 -0800
From: Savageduck <savageduck1@{REMOVESPAM}me.com>
Mime-Version: 1.0
User-Agent: Hogwasher/5.17
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit
Message-ID: <0001HW.201051D40082071C70000456A2CF@news.giganews.com>
Subject: Re: Olympus Leads the Japanese MILC Run
Newsgroups: rec.photo.digital
References: <fc8924F2pk4U1@mid.individual.net> <p3otmo$dq9$1@dont-email.me>
Lines: 59
X-Usenet-Provider: http://www.giganews.com
X-Trace: sv3-D76PBcqXVG6NoSgaq16WYfk4Se14GvKOVE1keucjRoBjcy1/rPIhcCtJ6US9QZRgnJE8fezJbYpQD92!6ngHl1UyDhjvvGvNDXF5ggFKYSZp2UEQ9h+C4VDiGSHo4TZVPLKMTZyhMoTDcVZRPFELUU1o9Jhv!igOJEhePKWs=
X-Complaints-To: abuse@giganews.com
X-DMCA-Notifications: http://www.giganews.com/info/dmca.html
X-Abuse-and-DMCA-Info: Please be sure to forward a copy of ALL headers
X-Abuse-and-DMCA-Info: Otherwise we will be unable to process your complaint properly
X-Postfilter: 1.3.40
X-Original-Bytes: 3828
Print Article
Forward Article
On Jan 17, 2018, Neil wrote
(in article <p3otmo$dq9$1@dont-email.me>):

> On 1/17/2018 1:33 AM, android wrote:
> > It's still a prosumer game...
> >
> > <http://www.canonrumors.com/bcn-rankings-are-out-canon-continues-to-...
> > -dslrs-further-growth-in-mirrorless/>
> >
> >
> > <http://tinyurl.com/y9ukoluy>
> I think it's interesting that this topic goes on and on about camera
> makes *other* than Olympus. I take it that there aren't many (if any)
> Olympus users in this group, so I'll chime in with my 2 cents.

I believe we have one or two regulars in this NG who are Olympus users. The 
majority are divided between Nikon and Canon.
>
> In film cameras, I have 3 makes: Olympus, Leica and Rolleiflex. I was
> always drawn to Olympus' superior technology when it came to compact
> design (OM-1, very durable, compact and reliable) metering (OM-4 is
> unique in this respect), and image quality. Its lenses aren't the best
> that I have, but then I have lenses for my Leica and Rollei that each
> cost more than a few entire Olympus kits. However, unlike my Zeiss,
> Leica and Schneider lenses, the Olympus' delivers consistent contrast
> over the range of stops. I realize this implies some compromises, but it
> makes it easier to use DOF as the primary variable when framing and
> shooting.

As I said earlier, my film cameras are currently a Pentax K1000, and a 
Yashica Electro35. I envy your Leica, and Rolleiflex.
>
> In digital cameras, I have Nikon and Olympus. The Olympus is superior in
> every way, from the available options to the structure of its menu,
> making significant changes easy and fast.

In the digital World I was first drawn to Nikon, and when it came time to 
move on, Olympus was for me a viable option along with Fujifilm. After 
considerable head scratching and making comparisons, I decided on Fujifilm 
for many of the same reasons you have stuck with Olympus. I have only been a 
Fujifilm user for three years, and I could not be happier with my choice. Had 
I decided on Olympus three years ago I have no doubt that I would have been 
just as happy.
>
> So, it doesn't surprise me in the least that those who are dedicated to
> photography find themselves drawn to the Olympus line.

To be fair, those dedicated to photography find themselves, for different 
reasons, drawn to the entire spectrum of great image producing machines 
including, but not limited to Olympus, Fujifilm, Nikon, Canon, Leica, 
PhaseOne, Panasonic, Sony, Pentax, Hasselblad, and others. It is just that 
many of us, pro, or enthusiast have made our choices, and in some cases have 
made a considerable investment in cameras, and glass.

-- 

Regards,
Savageduck 

	
Subject: Re: Olympus Leads the Japanese MILC Run
Full headers:
Path: news.netfront.net!goblin1!goblin.stu.neva.ru!eternal-september.org!feeder.eternal-september.org!reader02.eternal-september.org!.POSTED!not-for-mail
From: Neil <neil@myplaceofwork.com>
Newsgroups: rec.photo.digital
Subject: Re: Olympus Leads the Japanese MILC Run
Date: Thu, 18 Jan 2018 15:07:35 -0500
Organization: A noiseless patient Spider
Lines: 74
Message-ID: <p3qupu$r7s$1@dont-email.me>
References: <fc8924F2pk4U1@mid.individual.net> <p3otmo$dq9$1@dont-email.me>
<0001HW.201051D40082071C70000456A2CF@news.giganews.com>
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8; format=flowed
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
Injection-Date: Thu, 18 Jan 2018 20:07:27 -0000 (UTC)
Injection-Info: reader02.eternal-september.org; posting-host="839422096e0232bce0f03b1f3ab85096";
logging-data="27900"; mail-complaints-to="abuse@eternal-september.org";posting-account="U2FsdGVkX1+j6b3eyX/uTAZE42FOwasi1t/lAwN7EEc="
User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows NT 10.0; WOW64; rv:52.0) Gecko/20100101
Thunderbird/52.5.2
In-Reply-To: <0001HW.201051D40082071C70000456A2CF@news.giganews.com>
Content-Language: en-US
Cancel-Lock: sha1:zg4VzTNQEPIiWu/8rSx9IeJpLRM=
Print Article
Forward Article
On 1/17/2018 10:53 PM, Savageduck wrote:
> On Jan 17, 2018, Neil wrote
> (in article <p3otmo$dq9$1@dont-email.me>):
> 
>> On 1/17/2018 1:33 AM, android wrote:
>>> It's still a prosumer game...
>>>
>>> <http://www.canonrumors.com/bcn-rankings-are-out-canon-continues-to-...
>>> -dslrs-further-growth-in-mirrorless/>
>>>
>>>
>>> <http://tinyurl.com/y9ukoluy>
>> I think it's interesting that this topic goes on and on about camera
>> makes *other* than Olympus. I take it that there aren't many (if any)
>> Olympus users in this group, so I'll chime in with my 2 cents.
> 
> I believe we have one or two regulars in this NG who are Olympus users. The
> majority are divided between Nikon and Canon.
>>
>> In film cameras, I have 3 makes: Olympus, Leica and Rolleiflex. I was
>> always drawn to Olympus' superior technology when it came to compact
>> design (OM-1, very durable, compact and reliable) metering (OM-4 is
>> unique in this respect), and image quality. Its lenses aren't the best
>> that I have, but then I have lenses for my Leica and Rollei that each
>> cost more than a few entire Olympus kits. However, unlike my Zeiss,
>> Leica and Schneider lenses, the Olympus' delivers consistent contrast
>> over the range of stops. I realize this implies some compromises, but it
>> makes it easier to use DOF as the primary variable when framing and
>> shooting.
> 
> As I said earlier, my film cameras are currently a Pentax K1000, and a
> Yashica Electro35. I envy your Leica, and Rolleiflex.
>>
>> In digital cameras, I have Nikon and Olympus. The Olympus is superior in
>> every way, from the available options to the structure of its menu,
>> making significant changes easy and fast.
> 
> In the digital World I was first drawn to Nikon, and when it came time to
> move on, Olympus was for me a viable option along with Fujifilm. After
> considerable head scratching and making comparisons, I decided on Fujifilm
> for many of the same reasons you have stuck with Olympus. I have only been a
> Fujifilm user for three years, and I could not be happier with my choice. Had
> I decided on Olympus three years ago I have no doubt that I would have been
> just as happy.
>>
>> So, it doesn't surprise me in the least that those who are dedicated to
>> photography find themselves drawn to the Olympus line.
> 
> To be fair, those dedicated to photography find themselves, for different
> reasons, drawn to the entire spectrum of great image producing machines
> including, but not limited to Olympus, Fujifilm, Nikon, Canon, Leica,
> PhaseOne, Panasonic, Sony, Pentax, Hasselblad, and others. It is just that
> many of us, pro, or enthusiast have made our choices, and in some cases have
> made a considerable investment in cameras, and glass.
> 
No doubt that brand choices are made for various reasons, and some of 
the makes are comparable in most ways. I was fortunate, in that all of 
my kits paid for themselves through the work that I did with them. In 
terms of image quality, I think that lenses make the biggest difference.

In the digital world, I'd say that ease of use is pretty important, 
since they're all less efficient than film cameras. So, control 
placement, menu structure, and a well thought out user interface are the 
most important factors to me.

I've never been a fan of autofocus, finding it more of a compositional 
hindrance than a benefit. When combined with a varifocal lens, the 
camera becomes pretty useless to me. So, my choices are mostly for the 
least frustrating kits!

-- 
best regards,

Neil 

	
From: Savageduck <savageduck1@{REMOVESPAM}me.com>
Subject: Re: Olympus Leads the Japanese MILC Run
Full headers:
Path: news.netfront.net!goblin2!goblin.stu.neva.ru!peer02.am4!peer.am4.highwinds-media.com!peer02.iad!feed-me.highwinds-media.com!news.highwinds-media.com!border1.nntp.dca1.giganews.com!nntp.giganews.com!buffer1.nntp.dca1.giganews.com!buffer2.nntp.dca1.giganews.com!news.giganews.com.POSTED!not-for-mail
NNTP-Posting-Date: Thu, 18 Jan 2018 16:06:37 -0600
Date: Thu, 18 Jan 2018 14:06:37 -0800
From: Savageduck <savageduck1@{REMOVESPAM}me.com>
Mime-Version: 1.0
User-Agent: Hogwasher/5.17
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit
Message-ID: <0001HW.201151ED00BE0C83700006B122CF@news.giganews.com>
Subject: Re: Olympus Leads the Japanese MILC Run
Newsgroups: rec.photo.digital
References: <fc8924F2pk4U1@mid.individual.net> <p3otmo$dq9$1@dont-email.me> <0001HW.201051D40082071C70000456A2CF@news.giganews.com> <p3qupu$r7s$1@dont-email.me>
Lines: 90
X-Usenet-Provider: http://www.giganews.com
X-Trace: sv3-h54bYwJQFyHXaIG7Vnzav8PYiuTqpTCYYMJ+HpOhfpd/Jo8dFvlsyPzFuQBQHphTUaoBVra8W8QFlaM!GJBHEObj+WmpGWUzDhYxU7i8Tvr57NdwQ5NfSaAWGefVPwRnP5jAG5+DNDw8V6wdYdd//9BJUbqH!1KmKA8v+Z8s=
X-Complaints-To: abuse@giganews.com
X-DMCA-Notifications: http://www.giganews.com/info/dmca.html
X-Abuse-and-DMCA-Info: Please be sure to forward a copy of ALL headers
X-Abuse-and-DMCA-Info: Otherwise we will be unable to process your complaint properly
X-Postfilter: 1.3.40
X-Original-Bytes: 5498
X-Received-Body-CRC: 1220227637
X-Received-Bytes: 5741
Print Article
Forward Article
On Jan 18, 2018, Neil wrote
(in article <p3qupu$r7s$1@dont-email.me>):

> On 1/17/2018 10:53 PM, Savageduck wrote:
> > On Jan 17, 2018, Neil wrote
> > (in article <p3otmo$dq9$1@dont-email.me>):
> >
> > > On 1/17/2018 1:33 AM, android wrote:
> > > > It's still a prosumer game...
> > > >
> > > > <http://www.canonrumors.com/bcn-rankings-are-out-canon-continues-to-...
> > > > te
> > > > -dslrs-further-growth-in-mirrorless/>
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > <http://tinyurl.com/y9ukoluy>
> > > I think it's interesting that this topic goes on and on about camera
> > > makes *other* than Olympus. I take it that there aren't many (if any)
> > > Olympus users in this group, so I'll chime in with my 2 cents.
> >
> > I believe we have one or two regulars in this NG who are Olympus users. The
> > majority are divided between Nikon and Canon.
> > >
> > > In film cameras, I have 3 makes: Olympus, Leica and Rolleiflex. I was
> > > always drawn to Olympus' superior technology when it came to compact
> > > design (OM-1, very durable, compact and reliable) metering (OM-4 is
> > > unique in this respect), and image quality. Its lenses aren't the best
> > > that I have, but then I have lenses for my Leica and Rollei that each
> > > cost more than a few entire Olympus kits. However, unlike my Zeiss,
> > > Leica and Schneider lenses, the Olympus' delivers consistent contrast
> > > over the range of stops. I realize this implies some compromises, but it
> > > makes it easier to use DOF as the primary variable when framing and
> > > shooting.
> >
> > As I said earlier, my film cameras are currently a Pentax K1000, and a
> > Yashica Electro35. I envy your Leica, and Rolleiflex.
> > >
> > > In digital cameras, I have Nikon and Olympus. The Olympus is superior in
> > > every way, from the available options to the structure of its menu,
> > > making significant changes easy and fast.
> >
> > In the digital World I was first drawn to Nikon, and when it came time to
> > move on, Olympus was for me a viable option along with Fujifilm. After
> > considerable head scratching and making comparisons, I decided on Fujifilm
> > for many of the same reasons you have stuck with Olympus. I have only been a
> > Fujifilm user for three years, and I could not be happier with my choice.
> > Had
> > I decided on Olympus three years ago I have no doubt that I would have been
> > just as happy.
> > >
> > > So, it doesn't surprise me in the least that those who are dedicated to
> > > photography find themselves drawn to the Olympus line.
> >
> > To be fair, those dedicated to photography find themselves, for different
> > reasons, drawn to the entire spectrum of great image producing machines
> > including, but not limited to Olympus, Fujifilm, Nikon, Canon, Leica,
> > PhaseOne, Panasonic, Sony, Pentax, Hasselblad, and others. It is just that
> > many of us, pro, or enthusiast have made our choices, and in some cases have
> > made a considerable investment in cameras, and glass.
> No doubt that brand choices are made for various reasons, and some of
> the makes are comparable in most ways. I was fortunate, in that all of
> my kits paid for themselves through the work that I did with them. In
> terms of image quality, I think that lenses make the biggest difference.

I have always been an enthusiast/hobbyist, never a pro, and you are correct, 
lenses make the biggest difference.
>
> In the digital world, I'd say that ease of use is pretty important,
> since they're all less efficient than film cameras. So, control
> placement, menu structure, and a well thought out user interface are the
> most important factors to me.

....and that is one of the characteristics of the Fujifilm X-Series that I 
find appealing.
>
> I've never been a fan of autofocus, finding it more of a compositional
> hindrance than a benefit. When combined with a varifocal lens, the
> camera becomes pretty useless to me. So, my choices are mostly for the
> least frustrating kits!

I have several (4) Fujinon primes, and I find that I use MF much more than 
with my Nikon DSLRs. The thing which makes MF so easy for me is the Focus 
Peaking feature. Currently my most used lenses are the XF16mm f/1.4, and the 
XF23mm f/2.0.

-- 

Regards,
Savageduck 

	
From: nospam <nospam@nospam.invalid>
Subject: Re: Olympus Leads the Japanese MILC Run
Full headers:
Path: news.netfront.net!goblin1!goblin.stu.neva.ru!eternal-september.org!feeder.eternal-september.org!reader02.eternal-september.org!.POSTED!not-for-mail
From: nospam <nospam@nospam.invalid>
Newsgroups: rec.photo.digital
Subject: Re: Olympus Leads the Japanese MILC Run
Date: Thu, 18 Jan 2018 17:07:29 -0500
Organization: A noiseless patient Spider
Lines: 41
Message-ID: <180120181707290642%nospam@nospam.invalid>
References: <fc8924F2pk4U1@mid.individual.net> <p3otmo$dq9$1@dont-email.me> <0001HW.201051D40082071C70000456A2CF@news.giganews.com> <p3qupu$r7s$1@dont-email.me>
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit
Injection-Info: reader02.eternal-september.org; posting-host="2cbe69805f4244eea02152d38dc8db7e";
logging-data="13521"; mail-complaints-to="abuse@eternal-september.org";posting-account="U2FsdGVkX19D1k0bjxprKm0OsISpayNl"
User-Agent: Thoth/1.9.0 (Mac OS X)
Cancel-Lock: sha1:hX6lF3Rcy5xK4KDiEZbeXbCYivs=
Print Article
Forward Article
In article <p3qupu$r7s$1@dont-email.me>, Neil<neil@myplaceofwork.com>
wrote:

> > To be fair, those dedicated to photography find themselves, for different
> > reasons, drawn to the entire spectrum of great image producing machines
> > including, but not limited to Olympus, Fujifilm, Nikon, Canon, Leica,
> > PhaseOne, Panasonic, Sony, Pentax, Hasselblad, and others. It is just that
> > many of us, pro, or enthusiast have made our choices, and in some cases have
> > made a considerable investment in cameras, and glass.
> > 
> No doubt that brand choices are made for various reasons, and some of 
> the makes are comparable in most ways. I was fortunate, in that all of 
> my kits paid for themselves through the work that I did with them. In 
> terms of image quality, I think that lenses make the biggest difference.
> 
> In the digital world, I'd say that ease of use is pretty important, 
> since they're all less efficient than film cameras. 

digital cameras are *more* efficient, since they are not limited by
having mechanical linkages, film transport mechanisms, etc. nor do they
need to have film swapped every 36 shots (or less). control placement
can go *anywhere*, with the space that once was needed for film can be
repurposed for bigger batteries or faster and more capable electronics,
or just make a smaller camera. 

> So, control 
> placement, menu structure, and a well thought out user interface are the 
> most important factors to me.

that applies to every product.

there are examples of well thought out digital and film cameras as well
as poorly thought out ones and everything in between.

> I've never been a fan of autofocus, finding it more of a compositional 
> hindrance than a benefit. When combined with a varifocal lens, the 
> camera becomes pretty useless to me. So, my choices are mostly for the 
> least frustrating kits!

autofocus has the *most* benefit with varifocal lenses, and as a side
benefit, it offers more flexibility for the lens formula. 

	
Subject: Re: Olympus Leads the Japanese MILC Run
Full headers:
Path: news.netfront.net!goblin2!goblin.stu.neva.ru!aioe.org!eternal-september.org!feeder.eternal-september.org!reader02.eternal-september.org!.POSTED!not-for-mail
From: Neil <neil@myplaceofwork.com>
Newsgroups: rec.photo.digital
Subject: Re: Olympus Leads the Japanese MILC Run
Date: Thu, 18 Jan 2018 18:40:00 -0500
Organization: A noiseless patient Spider
Lines: 62
Message-ID: <p3rb88$i7n$1@dont-email.me>
References: <fc8924F2pk4U1@mid.individual.net> <p3otmo$dq9$1@dont-email.me>
<0001HW.201051D40082071C70000456A2CF@news.giganews.com>
<p3qupu$r7s$1@dont-email.me> <180120181707290642%nospam@nospam.invalid>
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8; format=flowed
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
Injection-Date: Thu, 18 Jan 2018 23:39:52 -0000 (UTC)
Injection-Info: reader02.eternal-september.org; posting-host="839422096e0232bce0f03b1f3ab85096";
logging-data="18679"; mail-complaints-to="abuse@eternal-september.org";posting-account="U2FsdGVkX18yRj3lKbFKrJ0ni/Drtd8xQm7APbd9ZV8="
User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows NT 10.0; WOW64; rv:52.0) Gecko/20100101
Thunderbird/52.5.2
In-Reply-To: <180120181707290642%nospam@nospam.invalid>
Content-Language: en-US
Cancel-Lock: sha1:+tIabC3NDp8oH5iP3lJuroeaUVA=
Print Article
Forward Article
On 1/18/2018 5:07 PM, nospam wrote:
> In article <p3qupu$r7s$1@dont-email.me>, Neil<neil@myplaceofwork.com>
> wrote:
> 
>>> To be fair, those dedicated to photography find themselves, for different
>>> reasons, drawn to the entire spectrum of great image producing machines
>>> including, but not limited to Olympus, Fujifilm, Nikon, Canon, Leica,
>>> PhaseOne, Panasonic, Sony, Pentax, Hasselblad, and others. It is just that
>>> many of us, pro, or enthusiast have made our choices, and in some cases have
>>> made a considerable investment in cameras, and glass.
>>>
>> No doubt that brand choices are made for various reasons, and some of
>> the makes are comparable in most ways. I was fortunate, in that all of
>> my kits paid for themselves through the work that I did with them. In
>> terms of image quality, I think that lenses make the biggest difference.
>>
>> In the digital world, I'd say that ease of use is pretty important,
>> since they're all less efficient than film cameras.
> 
> digital cameras are *more* efficient, since they are not limited by
> having mechanical linkages, film transport mechanisms, etc. nor do they
> need to have film swapped every 36 shots (or less). control placement
> can go *anywhere*, with the space that once was needed for film can be
> repurposed for bigger batteries or faster and more capable electronics,
> or just make a smaller camera.
> 
Those aspects describe flexibility, which I agree are where digital 
cameras excel. Efficiency is about how easily one can get the shot 
they're after, and having too many variables is a detriment to efficient 
management.

>> So, control
>> placement, menu structure, and a well thought out user interface are the
>> most important factors to me.
> 
> that applies to every product.
> 
> there are examples of well thought out digital and film cameras as well
> as poorly thought out ones and everything in between.
> 
I already covered that, which is why I prefer Olympus cameras to my 
Nikon digitals.

>> I've never been a fan of autofocus, finding it more of a compositional
>> hindrance than a benefit. When combined with a varifocal lens, the
>> camera becomes pretty useless to me. So, my choices are mostly for the
>> least frustrating kits!
> 
> autofocus has the *most* benefit with varifocal lenses, and as a side
> benefit, it offers more flexibility for the lens formula.
> 
There are two aspects of this where I'd disagree with you. First, 
autofocus presumes what you want to focus on, sometimes fights with you, 
and even in the best of cases screw up with varifocal lenses because the 
location of focus changes with focal length. Manually, I can focus much 
more quickly with a zoom lens because the focal point remains constant 
with focal length. YMMV.

-- 
best regards,

Neil 

	
From: nospam <nospam@nospam.invalid>
Subject: Re: Olympus Leads the Japanese MILC Run
Full headers:
Path: news.netfront.net!goblin2!goblin1!goblin.stu.neva.ru!eternal-september.org!feeder.eternal-september.org!reader02.eternal-september.org!.POSTED!not-for-mail
From: nospam <nospam@nospam.invalid>
Newsgroups: rec.photo.digital
Subject: Re: Olympus Leads the Japanese MILC Run
Date: Fri, 19 Jan 2018 14:19:59 -0500
Organization: A noiseless patient Spider
Lines: 89
Message-ID: <190120181419596416%nospam@nospam.invalid>
References: <fc8924F2pk4U1@mid.individual.net> <p3otmo$dq9$1@dont-email.me> <0001HW.201051D40082071C70000456A2CF@news.giganews.com> <p3qupu$r7s$1@dont-email.me> <180120181707290642%nospam@nospam.invalid> <p3rb88$i7n$1@dont-email.me>
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit
Injection-Info: reader02.eternal-september.org; posting-host="7bbef918661b9b2c72a5e1d8f263d674";
logging-data="2841"; mail-complaints-to="abuse@eternal-september.org";posting-account="U2FsdGVkX198fBNxeYbNrVzSQHyavmn7"
User-Agent: Thoth/1.9.0 (Mac OS X)
Cancel-Lock: sha1:bv0CVqo1JQMtiWsIWthV+qlJntk=
Print Article
Forward Article
In article <p3rb88$i7n$1@dont-email.me>, Neil<neil@myplaceofwork.com>
wrote:

> >> In the digital world, I'd say that ease of use is pretty important,
> >> since they're all less efficient than film cameras.
> > 
> > digital cameras are *more* efficient, since they are not limited by
> > having mechanical linkages, film transport mechanisms, etc. nor do they
> > need to have film swapped every 36 shots (or less). control placement
> > can go *anywhere*, with the space that once was needed for film can be
> > repurposed for bigger batteries or faster and more capable electronics,
> > or just make a smaller camera.
> 
> Those aspects describe flexibility, which I agree are where digital 
> cameras excel. Efficiency is about how easily one can get the shot 
> they're after, and having too many variables is a detriment to efficient 
> management.

they also describe efficiency.

no need to stop to change film, waiting for processing, needing to
bring sufficient film and of the correct type (daylight/tungsten,
etc.), keeping it cool, etc.

pick up a digital camera and shoot photos. results are instant, even
wirelessly syncing the photos to a computer, and in some cases, could
even be automatically uploaded to a web site (although most people
would want to at least review them first). 

the fuss is completely gone.

> >> So, control
> >> placement, menu structure, and a well thought out user interface are the
> >> most important factors to me.
> > 
> > that applies to every product.
> > 
> > there are examples of well thought out digital and film cameras as well
> > as poorly thought out ones and everything in between.
> > 
> I already covered that, which is why I prefer Olympus cameras to my 
> Nikon digitals.

why? 

nikon has a very well designed ui/ux, considered by many to be among
the best in the industry. in particular, the two control wheels and
several buttons on the body, some of which can be user-defined, along
with a page of user-defined menus which can even be invoked from a
custom button.

contrast that to having endless levels of menus and awkward button
placement (often not enough buttons, forcing users to use the menus).

one thing olympus film cameras did get right was multi-spot metering
with the om-3/om-4, which was incredibly useful for theatre photography
as well as other difficult lighting situations. otherwise, their ui/ux
was not very good and those cameras in particular had some reliability
issues.

> >> I've never been a fan of autofocus, finding it more of a compositional
> >> hindrance than a benefit. When combined with a varifocal lens, the
> >> camera becomes pretty useless to me. So, my choices are mostly for the
> >> least frustrating kits!
> > 
> > autofocus has the *most* benefit with varifocal lenses, and as a side
> > benefit, it offers more flexibility for the lens formula.
> > 
> There are two aspects of this where I'd disagree with you. First, 
> autofocus presumes what you want to focus on, sometimes fights with you, 
> and even in the best of cases screw up with varifocal lenses because the 
> location of focus changes with focal length. 

only when improperly used.

> Manually, I can focus much 
> more quickly with a zoom lens because the focal point remains constant 
> with focal length. YMMV.

autofocus automatically adjusts with varifocal lenses, making it
effectively equivalent to a true zoom. it 'just works'.

also, you can't focus quicker than autofocus no matter what lens you
use. autofocus can maintain focus on a moving subject coming directly
at you or away from you, even adjusting focus as you shoot multiple
shots while it moves. human reaction time is much too slow to keep up.

autofocus also works in very low lighting conditions where manually
focusing is difficult at best because of the low light. 

	
Subject: Re: Olympus Leads the Japanese MILC Run
Full headers:
Path: news.netfront.net!goblin2!goblin1!goblin.stu.neva.ru!eternal-september.org!feeder.eternal-september.org!reader02.eternal-september.org!.POSTED!not-for-mail
From: Neil <neil@myplaceofwork.com>
Newsgroups: rec.photo.digital
Subject: Re: Olympus Leads the Japanese MILC Run
Date: Fri, 19 Jan 2018 16:09:57 -0500
Organization: A noiseless patient Spider
Lines: 87
Message-ID: <p3tmqs$g31$1@dont-email.me>
References: <fc8924F2pk4U1@mid.individual.net> <p3otmo$dq9$1@dont-email.me>
<0001HW.201051D40082071C70000456A2CF@news.giganews.com>
<p3qupu$r7s$1@dont-email.me> <180120181707290642%nospam@nospam.invalid>
<p3rb88$i7n$1@dont-email.me> <190120181419596416%nospam@nospam.invalid>
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8; format=flowed
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
Injection-Date: Fri, 19 Jan 2018 21:09:48 -0000 (UTC)
Injection-Info: reader02.eternal-september.org; posting-host="cef3d852e3e344c1207c5da85b2c7aca";
logging-data="16481"; mail-complaints-to="abuse@eternal-september.org";posting-account="U2FsdGVkX189K/A9w+l5rLNk64/A59nNPLJR/njW7mY="
User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows NT 10.0; WOW64; rv:52.0) Gecko/20100101
Thunderbird/52.5.2
In-Reply-To: <190120181419596416%nospam@nospam.invalid>
Content-Language: en-US
Cancel-Lock: sha1:+EphRQrFaGqXUhbLMUXWe02RNDA=
Print Article
Forward Article
On 1/19/2018 2:19 PM, nospam wrote:
> In article <p3rb88$i7n$1@dont-email.me>, Neil<neil@myplaceofwork.com>
> wrote:
> 
>>>> In the digital world, I'd say that ease of use is pretty important,
>>>> since they're all less efficient than film cameras.
>>>
>>> digital cameras are *more* efficient, since they are not limited by
>>> having mechanical linkages, film transport mechanisms, etc. nor do they
>>> need to have film swapped every 36 shots (or less). control placement
>>> can go *anywhere*, with the space that once was needed for film can be
>>> repurposed for bigger batteries or faster and more capable electronics,
>>> or just make a smaller camera.
>>
>> Those aspects describe flexibility, which I agree are where digital
>> cameras excel. Efficiency is about how easily one can get the shot
>> they're after, and having too many variables is a detriment to efficient
>> management.
> 
> they also describe efficiency.
> 
How?

> no need to stop to change film, waiting for processing, needing to
> bring sufficient film and of the correct type (daylight/tungsten,
> etc.), keeping it cool, etc.
> 
For the pro, there is no need to do any of that anyway because they 
don't shoot willy-nilly, and if they need to shoot a lot of frames on a 
job, they buy a special back which can hold enough film for hundreds of 
frames. So, let's just drop that straw man and focus on efficiency as a 
matter of composition and execution.

>>>> So, control
>>>> placement, menu structure, and a well thought out user interface are the
>>>> most important factors to me.
>>>
>>> that applies to every product.
>>>
>>> there are examples of well thought out digital and film cameras as well
>>> as poorly thought out ones and everything in between.
>>>
>> I already covered that, which is why I prefer Olympus cameras to my
>> Nikon digitals.
> 
> why?
>
Go back and read it. I don't repeat posts.

>>>> I've never been a fan of autofocus, finding it more of a compositional
>>>> hindrance than a benefit. When combined with a varifocal lens, the
>>>> camera becomes pretty useless to me. So, my choices are mostly for the
>>>> least frustrating kits!
>>>
>>> autofocus has the *most* benefit with varifocal lenses, and as a side
>>> benefit, it offers more flexibility for the lens formula.
>>>
>> There are two aspects of this where I'd disagree with you. First,
>> autofocus presumes what you want to focus on, sometimes fights with you,
>> and even in the best of cases screw up with varifocal lenses because the
>> location of focus changes with focal length.
> 
> only when improperly used.
> 
It's a property of every varifocal lens I've used over several decades.

>> Manually, I can focus much
>> more quickly with a zoom lens because the focal point remains constant
>> with focal length. YMMV.
> 
> autofocus automatically adjusts with varifocal lenses, making it
> effectively equivalent to a true zoom. it 'just works'.
> 
That has not been my experience.

> also, you can't focus quicker than autofocus no matter what lens you
> use. autofocus can maintain focus on a moving subject coming directly
> at you or away from you, even adjusting focus as you shoot multiple
> shots while it moves. human reaction time is much too slow to keep up.
> 
I don't need to focus quicker, I need to focus where I want the focus to 
be and have it stay there during composition.

-- 
best regards,

Neil 

	
Next <
Subject: Re: Olympus Leads the Japanese MILC Run
Full headers:
Path: news.netfront.net!goblin2!goblin.stu.neva.ru!news.unit0.net!peer01.am4!peer.am4.highwinds-media.com!peer03.iad!feed-me.highwinds-media.com!news.highwinds-media.com!spln!extra.newsguy.com!newsp.newsguy.com!news6
From: PeterN <"peter,newdelete"@deleteverizon.net>
Newsgroups: rec.photo.digital
Subject: Re: Olympus Leads the Japanese MILC Run
Date: Fri, 19 Jan 2018 14:09:43 -0500
Organization: NewsGuy - Unlimited Usenet $23.95
Lines: 30
Message-ID: <p3tgu301ipn@news6.newsguy.com>
References: <fc8924F2pk4U1@mid.individual.net> <p3otmo$dq9$1@dont-email.me>
<0001HW.201051D40082071C70000456A2CF@news.giganews.com>
<p3qupu$r7s$1@dont-email.me>
NNTP-Posting-Host: pf01f383e50b791f4fa109afef485e6b168830c4c4ec6224b.newsdawg.com
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8; format=flowed
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows NT 6.1; WOW64; rv:52.0) Gecko/20100101
Thunderbird/52.5.2
In-Reply-To: <p3qupu$r7s$1@dont-email.me>
Content-Language: en-US
X-Received-Body-CRC: 2723524990
X-Received-Bytes: 2178
Print Article
Forward Article
On 1/18/2018 3:07 PM, Neil wrote:

<snip>

> No doubt that brand choices are made for various reasons, and some of 
> the makes are comparable in most ways. I was fortunate, in that all of 
> my kits paid for themselves through the work that I did with them. In 
> terms of image quality, I think that lenses make the biggest difference.
> 
> In the digital world, I'd say that ease of use is pretty important, 
> since they're all less efficient than film cameras. So, control 
> placement, menu structure, and a well thought out user interface are the 
> most important factors to me.

Each of us has our own criteria.

> 
> I've never been a fan of autofocus, finding it more of a compositional 
> hindrance than a benefit. When combined with a varifocal lens, the 
> camera becomes pretty useless to me. So, my choices are mostly for the 
> least frustrating kits!
> 
Autofocus can be a real PITA, or it can be a blessing, depending on the 
subject you are shooting. i rarely use AF for macro and landscape. When 
shooting critters it depends. For fast moving ones, I have found AF 
quite helpful. For some shots I prefer to preselect focus and exposure.


-- 
PeterN